The Gentle Way

[gtbear]

02/02/2014 at 3:09 am

Hello all that may lurk or comment here.

My thanks to those who have been posting their own experiences and advise in other threads. Your shared expertise has been of great value to me getting started. I should have started this journal on day 2 or 3 because much has happened that is now shrouded in yester-mist.

Pre-history: Our marrage has been primarily a D/s sort of relationship (me D her s). Not smooth, often filled with contention, bad behavior (mostly mine) however loving and mutually supportive over all. Our relationship was generally stable and well defined with me getting whatever I wanted and her more or less happily doing what she wanted to do. All this came to a screaching halt a few years ago when I found myself hospitalized, then given some incopacitating meds by the doctors. Until that I was something of a rock in her life and handled whatever problems came up with decisive ease. So, when I started training her to take over some of the day to day things that I had been handling but no longer could, a black cloud of fear (both for her future and for my survival) decended on her id. It has been a long haul since then. Worse for her by far than for me. Her wellbeing was disrupted to say the least and she had become prone to outbursts of real rage. Due I think to far too much responsibility and far too little emotional support from me.

I stopped taking the meds that were causing the incopacitation (under doctors supervision) and have since regained much of what was lost to me, both mentally and physically. With the return to cognisance and the semblance of physical ability, the realization that something had to be done to give back her lost happyness and percieved stability became a priority. Happy sub happy master.

After about a month of playing Trainer’s scripts (silents) 24/7 for my wife of 40 plus years, results, whether good or bad, have been easily observable, prolific and profound. Over all, for my purposes, amazing and excellent. I started her with the Converter file, HP Love You, and My Husband is My Master. Within 2 days, I was hearing exact lines from the scripts tumble from her mouth. After a week, I wrecklessly decided that with such great results, it must be time to move to play list 2 (My husband is my master, wife’s future, wife’s identy) again, with lines from the scripts coming out of her mouth at various times. I got greedy. and after a week of fantastic success and attitude realignment, decided to move on up… Play list 3 (Obedient wife, Wife Identity and Wife’s coc k sucker). 2 days passed and suddenly one afternoon she read me the riot act about not being a slave and not thinking it was ok for me to make her into a coc k sucker… Now, for all intents and purposes, she has been both for many many years and knows it perfictly well. So… I just backed off verbally and changed the script back to the second one. She imediately calmed down and it is as though the incident never happened. I am still playing the second script set and intend to ease her on to I love se x, Love Honor and Obey, Submissive thoughts in another week or so.

It is worth noting that since the first day the scripts started to play not one real outburst or even anger incident has occured. Outstanding!

I would, of course, appreciate any and all comments, concerns, or advise…

[J66R]

02/02/2014 at 7:51 am

I would say you’re both lucky and cursed with a wife that is so susceptible. You may need to be more careful than some of us. Pushing too far too fast because she seemed to accept the initial subs so quickly could cause some spectacular, albeit unpleasant, results. I’d say most of us notice the pushback early, since many of us never really had that place that you started from years back, and so before it get too bad we can adjust. But we all the same, get ahead of ourselves and a bit greedy and push too far and too fast as well, when we notice great responses. Even though your wife may be able to pickup some of this subconsciously, literally repeating lines directly from the subs, there is still that plain old human time to get used to things, that probably is the same as the rest of our wives. I think most of use have settled on a 1-2 month time frame for noticing changes as being the most prudent. Some wives take to some topics faster than other wives and they all seem to take to certain topics faster than they do others depending of personality traits, experiences and attitudes already existing. Yours seems to have started a bit further than most of ours, maybe because of her desire to return to a time of less responsibility. But still, you can’t erase the past few years of major changes in function and role of your relationship.

I think you are wise to step back to where she easily accepted the subs and let them percolate a while. Carefully study her responses, then take on one topic at a time and, again, carefully observe the results.

And, I’m sure you know as well as the rest of us, what women know “good and well” and whether or not they actually live by that often (read “almost always”) exist in two completely unrelated realities.

But, much luck as you pursue this journey. The progress you will see your wife make will be very satisfying, I’m sure. But hopefully it will also result in substantial adjustments and progress of your own. It has with me.

[tonguester4_69]

02/02/2014 at 3:25 pm

yeah , I agree that patience is key to this. It seems almost everyone gets too ambitious in the beginning, in that there is almost always noticeable changes in a very short time. Then we end up have to scale back, and bring discipline to our game plan. Does she know about the files? A big turning point for me , was when I told my wife, I was playing subliminals for her and she accepted it as OK. I think everyone should eventually get to this place, as for me anyway, it greatly increases the trust level.I do understand why most don’t however.

[gtbear]

02/02/2014 at 6:59 pm

@J66R said:

I would say you’re both lucky and cursed with a wife that is so susceptible. You may need to be more careful than some of us. Pushing too far too fast because she seemed to accept the initial subs so quickly could cause some spectacular, albeit unpleasant, results. I’d say most of us notice the pushback early, since many of us never really had that place that you started from years back, and so before it get too bad we can adjust. But we all the same, get ahead of ourselves and a bit greedy and push too far and too fast as well, when we notice great responses. Even though your wife may be able to pickup some of this subconsciously, literally repeating lines directly from the subs, there is still that plain old human time to get used to things, that probably is the same as the rest of our wives. I think most of use have settled on a 1-2 month time frame for noticing changes as being the most prudent. Some wives take to some topics faster than other wives and they all seem to take to certain topics faster than they do others depending of personality traits, experiences and attitudes already existing. Yours seems to have started a bit further than most of ours, maybe because of her desire to return to a time of less responsibility. But still, you can’t erase the past few years of major changes in function and role of your relationship.

I think you are wise to step back to where she easily accepted the subs and let them percolate a while. Carefully study her responses, then take on one topic at a time and, again, carefully observe the results.

And, I’m sure you know as well as the rest of us, what women know “good and well” and whether or not they actually live by that often (read “almost always”) exist in two completely unrelated realities.

But, much luck as you pursue this journey. The progress you will see your wife make will be very satisfying, I’m sure. But hopefully it will also result in substantial adjustments and progress of your own. It has with me.

J66R, Thanks for the comments. I think that the resposibility issue is actually really one of control. Power in the relationship that was given and will now need to be wrenched back. I am hopeful that with these subliminals the whole process can/will be less stressful (ie: if it is her idea, then I can pretty much just encourage that) than it would be otherwise.

I complemented my wife yesterday on her calmer approach to life in general and mentioned that she hasen’t been having the anger issues that she was having prior to the new year… she informed me that the reason for that is that I have improved my attitude toward her. Now, I still have the same attitudes, so again, I think the credit lands squarely on the scripts. Sweet! Positive reenforcement and time to let her test out the “trust” vs “fear” of less control in her day to day life looks like a pretty good path for me right now.

[gtbear]

02/02/2014 at 7:29 pm

@tonguester4_69 said:

yeah , I agree that patience is key to this. It seems almost everyone gets too ambitious in the beginning, in that there is almost always noticeable changes in a very short time. Then we end up have to scale back, and bring discipline to our game plan. Does she know about the files? A big turning point for me , was when I told my wife, I was playing subliminals for her and she accepted it as OK. I think everyone should eventually get to this place, as for me anyway, it greatly increases the trust level.I do understand why most don’t however.

Thanks for the reply. I am trying to reign in the initial burst of excitement. When first I started playing scripts for her my intent was that she not know it. That bubble got popped because trainer’s emails (from when one signs up) got left on my phone and were found there by the wife. She asked, “what is this dreamgirls that you have signed up for?” So I told her it is a subliminal script website and that I was going to be playing some scripts for her (and my) improvement. That was the end of any questions. So, yes, she sorta knows but is certainly not aware of the contents or purpose of the subliminals. Just dropping it like that is way out of normal for her. The first scripts had been playing only a couple of days when all that occured.

I am finding it harder to understand the motives in her thinking than it is to read results. Ultimately, it would seem that if the changes that are needed/wanted occur and are permanent, then unraveling all the little nuances of why is not really necessary. Of course I could be wrong about her inner dialog but by adding subliminals, it would seem that I should be aware of at least part of the girls thought process. Slow and patient is going to have to be the mantra for me.

[eldrin81]

02/02/2014 at 8:34 pm

Make a sub for yourself about being patient

[gtbear]

02/02/2014 at 10:36 pm

@eldrin81 said:

Make a sub for yourself about being patient

Sometimes it takes a slap to make me snap… obviously that’s exactly what I should do. I’ll have to be patient though, gotta wait for next month to get the Gold Membership.

[tonguester4_69]

02/02/2014 at 10:43 pm

When i started, my wife was completely unaware. I slowly worked my way into letting her know. If she’s not opposed, that is a huge plus as, you don’t have to hide the fact that they’re playing.if you’re writing your own, you can make them a music CD or mp3 playlist, or really anything that she would likely listen to. Also being in a D/s relationship prior is also a benefit, since most of us started with really obstinate and controlling wives. Personally I started with just wanting more sex and a little less aggravation.In the time since I’ve learned as much about myself , as I’ve learned about her.Good luck on your journey, and as you said patience is the mantra here.

[gtbear]

02/02/2014 at 11:05 pm

@tonguester4_69 said:

When i started, my wife was completely unaware. I slowly worked my way into letting her know. If she’s not opposed, that is a huge plus as, you don’t have to hide the fact that they’re playing.if you’re writing your own, you can make them a music CD or mp3 playlist, or really anything that she would likely listen to. Also being in a D/s relationship prior is also a benefit, since most of us started with really obstinate and controlling wives. Personally I started with just wanting more sex and a little less aggravation.In the time since I’ve learned as much about myself , as I’ve learned about her.Good luck on your journey, and as you said patience is the mantra here.

Many years ago I got into doing my own subliminals. The programs and info and abilities available at the time were not even close to what is available now. The computer that held all that stuff died years ago taking it all with it into oblivion and I haven’t fooled with it since. That is, judging by what I have been seeing here, almost certainly a good thing. I think, perhaps I have become more than a little lazy over the years and simply expect proper responses from the wife. This is going to require some mental streaching on my part. One step at a time then…

[eldrin81]

02/03/2014 at 1:36 am

Ya. I am normally a patient person, but concerning this I have not been. I tried several things to trick myself into not fiddling and flip flopping so much, but i have had the most success with a short custom patience script for myself. Gold membership really is worth its weight in gold…lol

[seekenq]

02/03/2014 at 4:03 pm

I think all of here have repeated the “too fast too soon” mistake.
It is easy to get overly excited after seeing some amazing early results – I know I did.
Slow and steady is a mantra you will read over and over on this forum and for good reason – it works.
Once you can be patient and settle into a slower pace things will just get better and better.
So far I have been fortunate to have no major backsliding.

I agree that going gold sooner rather than later is a good idea assuming you have some computer skills but it sounds like that is not an issue.
Customizing scripts is really important and the Gold forums are just that.
I started gold on day one and never regretted it.

To help with patience I took some good advice from others here and planned out some long term goals.
I then went back and started developing ideas for scripts as ideas popped into my head.
These are just placeholders, i.e. are a long way from going live, but is helps to get them out of my head.
I then go back and look at my long term goals and think about when / how I want to use them.
For me at least this process scratches the creative itch without actually needing to “go live”.

While everyone’s wife is different, I am running the same script for >>at least<< a month these days.
Even then I try to make evolutionary changes on the theme rather than jumping from one idea to another with 3 brand new scripts.
I use a 3 script structure (all customs). The first two are my “foundation scripts” and the third is for a specific behavior I want to support.
For now they are:
1) A variation on Love, Honor and Obey / His Happiness. The themes are: focus on my happiness, obeying, and begin more submissive.
2) A variation on I love Sex. The themes are: Happy being sexual, increasing sexual desire, frequency.
3) A variation on an Oral script with much borrowed from a bunch of folks here – many thanks!

Lastly, reading through all of the forums a couple of times in some cases is really helpful.
Based on the forums I have refined my scripts considerably and am now working on shorter and to the point.

I wish you all the best on your marathon (not sprint) journey!

[gtbear]

02/04/2014 at 12:57 am

@eldrin81 said:

Gold membership really is worth its weight in gold…lol

When I first signed up (for silver) my thought was “See how it works and then upgrade if it’s good.” I’m a bit past the “if it’s good” question but have to wait to upgrade to making customs. I still have a lot to learn about the whole process and I expect that my priorities may change or at least be refined with the passage of a bit more time. In the meantime, the results so far have been a little overwhelming… gotta catch my breath before jumping into deeper water.

[gtbear]

02/04/2014 at 1:37 am

@seekenq said:

I think all of here have repeated the “too fast too soon” mistake.
It is easy to get overly excited after seeing some amazing early results – I know I did.
Slow and steady is a mantra you will read over and over on this forum and for good reason – it works.
Once you can be patient and settle into a slower pace things will just get better and better.
So far I have been fortunate to have no major backsliding.

I agree that going gold sooner rather than later is a good idea assuming you have some computer skills but it sounds like that is not an issue.
Customizing scripts is really important and the Gold forums are just that.
I started gold on day one and never regretted it.

To help with patience I took some good advice from others here and planned out some long term goals.
I then went back and started developing ideas for scripts as ideas popped into my head.
These are just placeholders, i.e. are a long way from going live, but is helps to get them out of my head.
I then go back and look at my long term goals and think about when / how I want to use them.
For me at least this process scratches the creative itch without actually needing to “go live”.

While everyone’s wife is different, I am running the same script for >>at least<< a month these days.
Even then I try to make evolutionary changes on the theme rather than jumping from one idea to another with 3 brand new scripts.
I use a 3 script structure (all customs). The first two are my “foundation scripts” and the third is for a specific behavior I want to support.
For now they are:
1) A variation on Love, Honor and Obey / His Happiness. The themes are: focus on my happiness, obeying, and begin more submissive.
2) A variation on I love Sex. The themes are: Happy being sexual, increasing sexual desire, frequency.
3) A variation on an Oral script with much borrowed from a bunch of folks here – many thanks!

Lastly, reading through all of the forums a couple of times in some cases is really helpful.
Based on the forums I have refined my scripts considerably and am now working on shorter and to the point.

I wish you all the best on your marathon (not sprint) journey!

I will pause now in my forward rush to sculpt my idea of perfect submission in my wife’s brain. There is much more to consider. It seems to me, in the light of loving her, that if I am to pompusly stumble around in her skull, I should at least have some very clear idea of how all the changes will pan out (for both of us). Somehow, changing behavior seems different when it is cause and effect by correction and encouragement rather than subliminals. On the other hand, if the behavior modification can be accomplished by correcting the thought process without a cattle prod approach, then subliminals have got to be the way to go… not forced, not superficial, not by fear, just a matter of slowly and gently transitioning into the required frame of mind and so achiving lasting and benificial mods that meet my requirements. The process looks very little like training to me and more like nanites at work. I can train my dog and have trained subs but in the end, it looks like this process in more profound and likely more lasting. I want to add the right nanites. A real and flexable plan with well thoughtout goals is in order. Thanks for the heads-up!

[seekenq]

02/04/2014 at 3:39 pm

Bear

I think you are taking the right approach.
Thoughtfully and lovingly setting out your goals first.

Changing behavior absolutely relies on correction and encouragement.
Clear statements of what you want / expect (alpha male) coupled with a ton of positive reinforcement all along the way.
She needs to hear it all the time.
I don’t think of it as an either / or proposition though.
IMHO, The clear statements of your expectation plus positive reinforcement plus subliminals are the secret sauce

Subliminals work on the subconcious mind and are certainly helpful to break through unhealthy thought forms / ideas that are deeply entrenched.
Placing new thought forms out there for the subconcious to hear might work on their own but, at least in these pages, you will see that the guys who have the greatest success are doing all three (and usually more).

I would also observe that there is a common thread that runs deep in all of the regular posters here.
While all of us have differing goals for our relationships, I don’t think I would be out of line to say that we all deeply love our partners.
For me at least, I just got fed up with all the baggage (and everyone’s bags are different) that was getting in the way of a loving and sexual relationship that I believe we are all meant to have.
After about 4 months now my relationship is better that it has ever been and my wife is happier in it than she has every been.
Lately she tells me and her friends how happy she is all the time.
I’ll count that as a win on all counts.

[Tap]

02/05/2014 at 3:05 am

Welcome to the forums. I second what everyone says about making your own customs. I saw my greatest success and still do with my personalized customs. You can target exactly what you want and putting your name here and there makes it more personal for her.

[gtbear]

02/07/2014 at 1:41 am

Thanks guys,

It’s been only a couple of days since my last post but darned if I am not seeing some additional plus behavior from scripts set 2. That’s the fall back scripts set after the (very minor) revolt. It’s been playing again for some 10 days and nights now. What seems significant is that my wife, when I speak or give an opinion on something, is pausing whatever she is doing foucousing on me and listening very intently. Then, if it’s something that I was saying needed to be done or changed, I find her busily implementing the changes or getting the thing done. When I got up this morning, she had completely reorganized the kitchen and has been deep cleaning and streightening all afternoon. Seems happy and a bit proud of herself after some mild praise.

She is regaining her submissive nature bit by bit and does not argue or really resist simple statements or gentle commands.
Yesterday, some out-of-state relitives that are having some finantial problems became a bone of contention in our afternoon conversation. I decided to test her (while she was frustrated by their behavior) to see if a little waffeling on my part, about whether or not to send them some money, might cause a major outburt. She got very upset and angry then left the room and returned a few minutes later with a serious appoligy. Stayed very attentive and submissive for the rest of the day. Today she mentioned that her outburst was the relitives fault… How nice! She is looking for and needing decisiveness from me instead of simply making the decisions about such things. I am continuing the #2 play list for awhile longer.

A note: at about the time of the playlist that resulted in rebellion, during the day for about 2 days I played the weight loss script for her. That was replaced when I went back to the #2 play list. The point is that at various times over the the last few days, she has commented about wanting to loose some weight and is actually researching and asking if I think this or that will work. I really did not expect much of anything from the brief time that played… the thoughts of weight loss have just slowly percolated up to the top of her mind (without reenforcement or continued playing by me). Wow…

As for planning: For now, we will be working on her submissiveness in our relationship. As time progresses and she reverts back to her old slave girl self, I have some spicific changes in mind for her. Those will require a Gold Membership.

[Fizbin]

02/07/2014 at 4:12 am

Congratulations on the progress. You aren’t the first to see delayed responses to latent suggestions, so I am not surprised by the weight loss bubbling up. Of course, that particular subject is never far from the top of mind for most women – no matter their objective weight. That few days of push was probably sufficient.
Keep up the good work!

[gtbear]

02/09/2014 at 7:38 am

@Fizbin said:

Congratulations on the progress. You aren’t the first to see delayed responses to latent suggestions, so I am not surprised by the weight loss bubbling up. Of course, that particular subject is never far from the top of mind for most women – no matter their objective weight. That few days of push was probably sufficient.
Keep up the good work!

Fizbin,

Your post has caused me to ponder the ‘why’ of what is showing dramatic results in my wife’s appearant acceptance of some scripts and the resistance to other script suggestions. After a little closer inspection of what has worked, it would appear that those emotions and beliefs that are already there (though perhaps suppressed or simply unvoiced) in her, are easily reenforced and expanded on with fast and good results. It seems to me that cultivating submissiveness and obedience, things I believe she basis on love and respect for me, should easily produce a good foundation for later and more radical changes. A little more ‘Alpha Male’ from me should reenforce the whole process.

Or… that’s all balderdash and one should just blast away (the nanites will carry the day!).

I will remain patiently observant and try to ease along in this venture. I continue to learn as progress unfolds.

[eldrin81]

02/09/2014 at 2:24 pm

It is true that behaviors she would normally be more into will bring faster progress. An example: Getting a woman who dyes her hair frequently to dye her hair red via subliminal, would be easy and quick. Getting a woman who despises oral sex to give you head, much different and much harder/takes longer. However there is also something to say for that fact that some women seem to be more susceptible overall to these subliminals.

Its just as Fizbin pointed out, most women want to lose weight and are constantly thinking about it anyway so that an easy one to see progress on.

[seekenq]

02/09/2014 at 3:56 pm

All else being equal I think that it’s better to start with some suggestions that are already aligned with her existing thought patterns.
Bringing out behaviors that she supports but represses should help her to build trust in the subconscious voices she is hearing.
Adding positive reinforcement from you makes them stick even better.
From there you can move gradually into more challenging subjects
It has been suggested here that once she starts accepting / trusting suggestions it gets easier for her mind to accept future ones.

My theory is the “just bang away” method could create some dissonance that cause her to doubt the subconscious voices.
This could undermine all your efforts and end up taking a lot longer to achieve your goals.

Also, seeing what works >>for her<< and adapting your scripts helps give you the skills needed to take on the more advanced subjects.
I think it would be a mistake to jump right into a mode difficult subject before you have built a strong foundation and developed your knowledge / skills.

[gtbear]

02/09/2014 at 11:51 pm

I’m thinking now that it would be good to drop back to the first set of scripts for a few days just to reenforce the voices and her acceptance of them. That’s back to the converter and love you and husband is my master. then I will make a new disk with my husband is my master, Submissive thoughts and LHO. Assuming that there isn’t a big push back, I’ll leave that playing for long enough to settle in. After that I should have a Gold Membership and should be able to step up the game. Time will tell.

[Tap]

02/10/2014 at 1:18 am

I don’t think converter is necessary. If you just do love you and husband is my master, they will get more playing time and will have more of an effect.

[gtbear]

02/10/2014 at 2:50 am

Well… If the converter has done what it is supposed to then I guess that it is no longer needed. I’ll make a new disk with just the Love You and My Husband is My Master scripts and start it tonight. She’s been listening to the later as part of just about every script since the start (that’s about a full month now day and night). This script set is ment to be a transition set to move her on to the Submissive Thoughts and LHO. I was thinking that Husband / Master would sorta tie the sets togeather. If that’s not necessary on the second set above, then I could easily leave it out for more impact for the other two scripts. Please let me know what you think.

[Fizbin]

02/10/2014 at 5:21 am

Submissive Thoughts, Wife includes the line “My husband is my Master.”

[gtbear]

02/10/2014 at 8:39 am

OK… that should tie things togeather nicely. I would not have thought that one line would be enough but that thought has been placed as solidly as anything and it really goes back a long way before the subliminals.

Here’s the breakdown as it stands now with the goal being Gold scripting starting in March. Starting tonight, I Love You Husband – Sledge with My Husband is My Master. To run for one week. Then LHO – Sledge and Submissive Thoughts for one week. Last in foundation series is His Happyness – Sledge and Her Submissive Nature, these last will stay on into March while I become educated in the Gold area. That should give the last set at least a total of 2 weeks runtime and (I hope) lay a solid foundation for what is to come later in March. Of course, I’ll be monitoring progress on each set and adjusting as needed along the way.

Comments and concerns about the above will be much appreciated.
Thanks to everyone who has given me all the (much needed) support up to this point.

[seekenq]

02/11/2014 at 4:20 am

I would just reiterate the 1 month before changing scripts as a good rule of thumb.
Once you go gold – post some script ideas int eh gold forums and get some feedback before going live.
Also, be sure to read all the gold forums end to end – lots of helpful advice in there.

[J66R]

02/11/2014 at 8:12 am

I’ll add a great big “Aye” on waiting at least 1 month between script changes.
That one month is not just for seeing the results, but if you read the forum posts, sometimes it takes that long to go through any “proper” pushback.
If you change too quickly you may miss some cues.
Most of us have seen massive changes in extremely short time periods on certain isolated scripts, only to move on too quickly and ruin much of the progress made.

kind of like slapping that whole plastic model kit together all in an hour or so with too liberal amounts of the orange smelling model glue. So satisfying that you’re done, all the decals are on and the pieces seem to have stayed together. But the next morning it looks like crap and pieces have bent under their own weight as the glue softened the plastic and the decals are curled up and all those fingerprints!

Short runs can be useful to reinforce slipping behaviors or to set immediate moods, but I would not rely on their effects being any where near permanent or even long term or as part of a chain to more advanced topics.

[eldrin81]

02/11/2014 at 4:13 pm

Agreed with 30 day minimum. Although note that cutting the fat, ie taking out lines but leaving others unchanged is not a bad thing during the 30 days.

1) Best thing is, when your write your first script, submit it here for feedback.
2) Mull over said feedback and make any changes.
3) Sleep on it.
4) Re read the next morning, if you feel the need to make changes, then go back to step 3.
5) If you are perfectly happy with it and no new feedback has been given, then encode and go live for 30+ days, otherwise go back to step 3.

Always have a specific goal for the script in mind, resist the urge to tackle several topics, and always have an upper limit on lines/time duration.

Generally 20 lines or less is good, 10 lines is great. Analyze every line and make sure you aren’t just saying the same thing in a different way needlessly.

[gtbear]

02/12/2014 at 12:48 am

Damn…

I seem to have a bit of a glitch when it come to patience that lasts more than a week or two.

So, The first script pair went on and then, unnoticed by me failed to repeat. That’s what I get for starting it in the dark. With the input from all of you, I am getting a grip again and moving ahead with only the first set until probably mid March. That’s 2 scripts one of which has been playing for 90 percent of Jan. and 8 more days and nights of Feb. In Mar. while these same scrips play, I will work up and seek approval for the first modified or perhaps new script/s. If nothing else, this process is going to modify my perception of what a “short time” should be. Without the input from you all, I would be totally messing this up. Thank you all.

[seekenq]

02/12/2014 at 6:40 am

Bear

Nothing to worry about.
If you go back through the forum you will see that we all made the same mistake in one way or another.
The pattern seems almost unavoidable – Amazing early success >> excitement and enthusiasm >> push to far to fast >> crash and burn >> learn patience.
Fortunately I had lot’s of good advice and managed to avoid the crash and burn.
Once you’ve been at it for a couple months the patience will come.
Hang in there

[gtbear]

02/13/2014 at 6:09 pm

A short but to me, important development. Last night, at about 11:00 pm.. I suggested to my wife that she should go to bed and to sleep to be rested for a doctor’s appointment this morning. She was resistive and made small remarks to the effect that she would go to bed when she was ready and not before. I let it sit for a few minutes and then said, “Go to bed and go to sleep now”. That was done in an ‘off hand’ sort of way and in a quiet and gentle voice. I walked to the kitchen got a glass of water and returned to find her in bed and asleep (snoring!). No argument, no resistance, just did what she was instructed to do. I realize that this may not seem like a major thing but the manner of compliance and the blinding speed of going to sleep left me a bit breathless and amazed. Today, she is rested and perky with appearantly no memory of the incident. I am very happy with the whole thing. As training progresses I will slowly be integrating the change from suggesting behavior to simply stating the required behavior. Slowly! Carefully! Gently!

[trainer81]

02/13/2014 at 7:00 pm

Good the first step in any girl’s training is always a stepping stone forward. Keep doing what your doing and you’ll be fine.
Though my girl is a slave, my first step was building trust.

Trainer81

[seekenq]

02/14/2014 at 2:05 am

Congrats!

Sounds like great progress.
Often the most amazing part of the success is not what was done but how it was done.
The big goals will come in time.
Celebrating the little victories like this along the way makes it easier to wait.

[eldrin81]

02/14/2014 at 3:23 am

@gtbear said:

Damn…

I seem to have a bit of a glitch when it come to patience that lasts more than a week or two.

So, The first script pair went on and then, unnoticed by me failed to repeat.

Ya. For whatever reason my ipad mp3 app sometimes stops repeating at some unknown point during the night. Doesn’t happen often but it pisses me off when I wake uP and there seems to be no reason for it. Still, it’s so rare it’s not worth worrying about. I always turn everything off, all background apps, turn on airplane mode etc, to ensure it plays without interruption. If I wake in the middle of the night I will check it, all I have to do is stick my ear right next to the speaker and listen for the faint squeaking. Same thing in the morning since I always get up an hour or two befor the wife.

You just gotta get into a bedtime routine really with your subliminal setup. And one night lost is aggravating, but it’s a small drop in the bucket in the big picture .

[gtbear]

02/14/2014 at 4:31 am

Trainer and Seekeng,

Very encouraging indeed… I have a long way to go and a lot to learn. Everyone’s input helps a lot.

eldrin81,

I have the scripts on CD that is playing continously on the home stereo. In the dark I pushed the wrong button and turned off the repeat function. The CD played once and then quit. On the CD, the 2 scripts are recorded twice each. It was opperator error. I have it down now and things are back to running fine.

I expect that I’ll want to get away from the home stereo and hook things up wirelessly perhaps through the xbox and computer so that it will make things easier for modifing scripts in the future. That should / may be done March when it starts to be a hastle disk wise. As it is, it is working great right now and is running 24/7…

[gtbear]

02/14/2014 at 11:54 pm

One of the things that eats at me about using the silent scripts is that I do not hear any squeeking or other sounds coming over the speakers. At least part of that is due to sitting next to turbine engines and large aircraft transmissions for a couple of years back in 67 – 1969. C, the wife, is partially deaf and does not hear the cds playing either. Obviously, she is getting the subliminal input… Anyway, I wonder if there isn’t some way to verify that the output is actually reaching the speakers? When outward signs of successful scripts are easily observable that serves as a way of verifing they are actually playing but when those signs don’t seem to be present, I start to wonder if there is a problem.

A second thing that is bothering me is why most of these tracks (scripts) are 10 to 15 minutes long on the cd. Are the scripts repeated several times? If so, I would like to know the number of repititions per statement per script. If not, I would like to know why they take up so much time. Just curious…

[gtbear]

02/15/2014 at 1:12 am

Back to logging events:

A series of attitudenal events have bubbled up over the last few days leading to Valentines day. I have for the past few days been suggesting things that seemed like good ideas for me to do for her for Valentines day. Like get her flowers or go to a movie and dinner out. Each idea has been met with OK but… (“it’s really not something I’m interested in”) or no, don’t do that. A bit frustrating but I have waited to see how it would all shake out and now have the answer. She bought and is cooking a couple of serious steaks for tonights dinner and has picked out a movie or two she thinks will be enjoyed by me. It’s her way of giving me a special evening and that is what she really wanted all along. She is being very loving and attentive. I am preparing to be very complementary and sweetly appreciative. It’s not about her … she has made the day to be about me. So, a polar opposite Valentines day. Ya gotta love it.

[eldrin81]

02/15/2014 at 2:14 am

Typically with husbands happiness type scripts this is the frustration point the husband must get over. He is so used to giving and giving to his wife, that when these things kick in he is a bit off guard when he finds all his wife wants to be happy is his pleasure. My wife has done this a few times when I was playing a Similar themed custom script, and it took me a bit to wrap my head around.

I would be willing to bet many of the husbands here are like me, they gain immense satisfaction from pleasing and doing for their wife, only to be frustrated when it is never quite reciprocated.
Keep at it, sounds like good progress. In 30 or so days if you stay the course, this behavior may become so cemented she is permanently that way. She seems to respond easy to these subliminals as well.

[gtbear]

02/15/2014 at 4:24 am

eldrin81,

I am constantly being supprised by C’s various ways of acting on the subliminals. I read the scripts and do not forsee the behaviors that she brings out as a result of listening to them. Some of the ways she reacts to the scripts are predictable and due to many years of training reenforcement. Some of her behaviors, are just being fine tuned by the scripts, and others are being moved from the rear of her mind to the front. The way they manifest seems like a blend of old training and newly occuring submissive awareness. Some seem to be requiring a bit of a scrap in her own mind but the battles are slowly tilting in a very positive direction.

I have been noticing a propensity in her to be on the lookout for little things that irritate me and remove them or make them so that they do not bother me. Protectiveness? It dawns on me that has been one of her duties over last few years. It could be that I have just become clear headed enough to recognize it… To me, that is potentially a problem as taken just a bit further it may become an irritation all on it’s own. I am hoping, that behavior will not escalate into trying to be incharge of my happyness or for that mater incharge of anything other than accomplishing her assigned duties. I don’t want her to become possive or jelous or think she is somehow supposed to choose (anything) for me. Unless of course she is instructed to do so. For now, I will keep a close eye on this and plan on adding in the My Decision Maker Hubby scripts early in her retraining program. Those should go nicely with the Husbands Happiness scripts or lines from both… Permanent is what I am looking for but slightly off the mark could be problematic in the extreme. So far so good. Thanks again for your input.

[gtbear]

02/15/2014 at 8:48 am

A quick post script to “Back to logging events” above:

All went wonderfully, movie was great, steaks and fixins were great, girl’s attitude was great. I told her she had absolutely made my day and that she had made this Valentines day very special for me. The evening came to an end very late and as I held her and kissed her she dreamily said, “You are my whole world”. That’s almost a direct quote from the scripts. I told her that I love her too and she just beamed. Then I told her, “go to bed now and sleep”. She happily did. Life is good.

[seekenq]

02/15/2014 at 5:03 pm

Bear

First, congratulations on what sounded like a great Valentines Day.

Regarding your concerns over potential problem…
I am pretty sure you will be able to manage this with custom scripts when you go gold.
For now the sliver scripts sound like they are getting C headed in the right direction.

Regarding your question on how to see if the CD scripts are playing…
If you play the CD in to Windows Media Player a window will open with the file name etc.
Right click in that window and choose visualizations, Bars and Waves, then Bars.
This produces a set of bars each representing activity in a frequency band.
For the silent files you will see some activity on the far left and some on the far right with nothing in between.
Shows you it’s working even if you can’t hear it.

[eldrin81]

02/15/2014 at 6:39 pm

Since everyone on this planet learned words from context and not some unified dictionary, each person has their own interpretation of a word’s underlying meaning and tones. That’s one of the reasons why Gold is so powerful, you can edit things that she reacts to in unexpected ways.

[gtbear]

02/16/2014 at 3:45 am

@seekenq said:

Regarding your question on how to see if the CD scripts are playing…

I have Media Player and will give that a try.

Thanks, that’s exactly the sorta solution I was hoping for.

[gtbear]

02/16/2014 at 4:05 am

@eldrin81 said:

Since everyone on this planet learned words from context and not some unified dictionary, each person has their own interpretation of a word’s underlying meaning and tones. That’s one of the reasons why Gold is so powerful, you can edit things that she reacts to in unexpected ways.

eldrin,

I would think that for there to be language and not just babel there should be some common thread… otherwise we’d just be using pictures instead of words. Perhaps priming the verbal pump to get a common meaning before affirmations are played? Or doing so in the script by changing the wording from line to line to cover the spoken bases? One other thought on the subject is that it might be of some value to tie the affirmation/s to positive emotions in different ways in the script. It seems like, reading some of the other threads here, that atleast some of the success stories have scripts that resonate with emotional triggers. One more thought is that it could be of value to make the affirmations immediate and/or delivered as accomplished fact.

I am so new to this that the above is almost certainly shot through with gaping holes in logic and effectiveness. Take it all with the lump of salt it deserves.

[eldrin81]

02/16/2014 at 2:05 pm

All I am saying is that yes, there is a common thread to language, but its also open to interpretation or error since most people don’t look up word meanings, and just rely on context thru conversation. So always keep an eye out for odd, unexpected behaviors, and try to find the root cause in the script. For many who have tried a slave script for instance, the usage of the word slave and property depressed their wives.

Yes it doesn’t hurt to use some words in conversation to try to establish exactly what you mean, or explain it further in the script with other forms. A Thesaurus can sometimes be your friend.

For instance, my wife never uses the word submission. So I wasn’t confident she got the full meaning of what I meant by that word. So I used other affirmations to support it, like giving in, giving up control, yielding.

[seekenq]

02/16/2014 at 4:40 pm

I agree with Eldrin.
I often use a thesaurus when creating scripts.
Really helpful in avoiding conditional statements or creating positive phrases instead of negative ones.
Every woman is different and this is why custom scripts can be so powerful.
You know your girl better than anyone and by incorporating words/phrases the two of you use in conversation into your scripts work that much better.
For example a term of endearment we use is sweetie so I use it in my scripts but it probably wouldn’t be effective in yours.
Tying things that happen in the “real world” to your scripts can very powerful in reinforcing and supporting the subconscious messages.
I found amazing success with a Christmas present reference in a script as an example.

Eldirn makes an excellent point about watching closely for feedback and adjusting (custom scripts).
As Eldrin points out a lack of success could be a vocabulary / context issue.
You might have a clear idea in your mind about the meaning of submission but there is no guarantee it has any meaning/context for your girl.
Explaining what submission looks like, i.e giving in, giving up control, yielding (hmmm, all words from a thesarus) might be more effective.
A lack of success in an area could be simply because of choosing the wrong words.

Repeating the Mantra – You have to be careful about pushing too hard too fast.
I have tried some things and then immediately backed off / deleted lines from scripts if I saw signs of negative reactions.
Although I have not used it in my scripts, the word slave is a good example.
It is a highly charged word and could have big negative connotations or create too much dissonance in the subconscious to be accepted by your girl.
IMHO, high levels of subconscious dissonance is something to be avoided since it could lead to questioning/rejection of all the messaging.
Instead, choose other words / phrases that have similar meaning but avoid the negativity and dissonance.
Others may disagree and suggest pushing through resistance issues – I would love to hear thoughts from others on this.

Also, consider that a words /phrases /concepts that might cause problems today could possibly be incorporated later.
This is where I think having long term goals and a plan to get there is essential.
Gradually, over a period of months, you can introduce “challenging” concepts and gain acceptance without creating the severe dissonance.
Starting with an indirect reference to X , then move to thinking about X , then becoming X, then want to have/be X, Enjoy X, Need to have/be X, Must have /be X, always do X, need to do X all the time, Have always felt this way about X, etc.
Think of The old story about the frog in the boiling water.

You could also build a strong positive thought pattern around X then gradually replace X with the more challenging Y.
A simple example: Build a trust and obedience to Bear pattern then introduce trust and obedience to master bear (adding one word) then drop bear and just use master. In parallel you could add a statement about Bear being my Master at some point along the way.

[eldrin81]

02/16/2014 at 5:47 pm

The negative resistance is why I spent so much time on my Happy Submissive Slave script, trying to associate the word with choice, freedom, happiness, safety etc. The word slave perfectly encompassed the servant attitude I was looking for in my wife: wanting my happiness, submitting to my will etc. But I don’t want her to be downtrodden. My definition of slave is a bit different than its traditional meaning. So far so good for me, in a week or two we will see if she is displaying any poor emotions, but also keep in mind I have used submissive scripts on my wife before, its just not been cemented into permancy yet.

The main takeaway I would say is paramount in writing your own scripts is Focus and Theme. There should be an overall theme and focus that really feels like the affirmations all belong together, and aren’t just some disparate list of affirmations thrown together. You really should be able to sum up the Focus and Theme in a single sentence, or the title of the script.

The other takeaway in script writing is the more effective the wording, the shorter it can be, and the shorter it can be the more repetitions it will get. However, don’t make the same mistake Tap and I did, of shooting for some arbitrary number, and losing the meaning of the script along the way. Some scripts are better with a little more length, unless you can really master the wording.

[MasterSouthernStar]

02/16/2014 at 8:09 pm

Seekenq;

I like the common sense you show in your “step by step” approach. I think it makes perfect sense that – if we’re trying to from A to Z that it’s a whole lot more effective to go all the way through the alphabet one letter at a time rather than trying to take one giant step. It just makes sense. That’s also the reason that these customs make sense; each girl is starting from a different place with different preconceptions. For instance in my case, my girl is not only comfortable with the “slave” label but actually likes it. So that’s a hurdle I don’t have to jump. However, as Eldrin points out, for most folks the word “slave” is a big bump in the road all by itself. I believe in doing all that can be done to make the message as easily assimilated as possible. That means appropriate vernacular and ideology are necessary for the subject’s comfort. If we are to expect the subject to be comfortable with the end result, I believe we need to strive to make the change as comfortable as possible. In fact isn’t that why we’re all here; to use these recordings to make these changes seem like “her” own idea?

MSS

[gtbear]

02/17/2014 at 1:47 am

Thanks fellow travelers,

I am going to try to digest these last few posts as much as I am able before going gold in March.

I titled the thread ‘The Gentle Way’ as a reference to Judo (the gentle way) not because subliminals are the only way but as an allusion to letting the wife’s resistance to change become the catalist for her eventual improvement. In reality, if her will is not to be overcome and subjugated, resisted areas may only be open to discussion. Then, if she is to retain her freedom of thought and action, anything or anyone that influences her, using seduction or really any other means, is manipulating her and thus limiting her freedom.

Women have the right to change their minds but men have the right (and responsablility) to change it back.

“Slave” has become a relitive term. Perhaps those women who are resistive to the word are relating to a lifetime of appling the images and attitudes of pre- 1865 to the word. Forced, non-consentual, harsh, heavy labor, without remuneration, with little care or no concern for the wellfare of those enslaved, that is illegal and immoral in the extreme. That kind of ‘slave’ and slavery still exists but is not what those here are engaged in. Small wonder many of the women here are negatively reactive to the term.

I was reading a post by Trainer about his ‘slave girl’ that exemplifies another look into the term slave. He mentioned something to the effect that his slave girl had “decided to make service to him her career”. She decided. After a lot of helpful programing. Mind changing. Attitude adjusting etc. To me, “A rose, by any other name still smells as sweet”. When I was married, C swore to “Love, Honor, and Obey me among other things. As time has passed, I have held her to that (and it ain’t been easy). She is now enslaved by her consent but enslaved non-the-less. I do not feel the need to have that consent repeated redundantly. C is bound to me, not like Golem to the Ring but by love. Her service and submissiveness is part of the outward measure of what has become her identity. That identity has been shaped by me. She has chosen to be what I want her to be… changing her perception of what that is, without damaging her ‘self’ or unraveling past work, is why I have chosen this ‘gentle path’. I cherish who she is, but think it is ok to cut and pollish the gem. It is ok for her to bloom where she is planted but I’ll decide where that spot is to be.

Ultimately, since we all do the will of someone else in various ways and at various times, we are all enslaved to that extent (whether consentual or not). It matters how power over another is applied. It matters how the one on the receiving end of that use of power percieves it and it matters how it effects / affects them. How all this subliminal stuff shakes out in the lives of the sub gals defines the charicter of those who are implementing the scripts. Just in passing, I would like to mention that at least those who are posting seem to be among the highest sorts, motivationally and morally.

Of course there’s more to the slave word but my rant as run it’s course. Back to logging for me.

[gtbear]

02/17/2014 at 2:09 am

This afternoon I had my suspicions confermed about the “Protective” actions on C’s part. Also, because I was paying attention to detail, I recognized the actions as having roots going back to me passing her responsibility and her worrying about my health.

She was on the phone with a relitive about some problems occuring with another relitive. I asked her what was up and she replied, “you don’t need to know, it’ll just stress you out”. Although I would have been perfectly happy to not be stressed, having her summarily decide, after being asked, not to tell me, made me realize that it was intervention time. I told her that I didn’t want her to make those sort of decisions without asking me and then said, “tell me now”. Well… she was right about it not being something I wanted or needed to hear. It did stress me out a bit. Guess I’ll just have to get over it. On the other hand, she did what she was told and only pouted about it a little bit. Later, she made a few, very minor comments about things that seemed like she was testing the waters on just what is expected of her. Tonight, when I came out of my office, she was talking to a different relitive about more problems this one was having. I said, “what’s this about” and she told me, without hesitation or rancor. For the time being, I think that portion of the ‘shield effect’ has been delt with enough that I can concentrate on other things until March.

[gtbear]

02/17/2014 at 10:55 pm

I have been noticing, for the last week or so, that C is developing the need to be concisely instructed (ordered) concerning the implementation of relitively simple things. The need seems to hover around things that she would have just done without instruction before or when she feels a bit uncertain about my wishes in the matter. She is responding to simple flat statements (commands) of my expectations for her behavior / duties / tasks with simple compliance and when I mention that it makes me happy when she does this or that according to my wishes and without resistance, she is obviously pleased and gratified. What made me add this to the record is that early this afternoon as she was preparing to do some trivial task she suddenly paused and asked me if it was ok to do it. I said sure it’s ok and it pleases me that you are asking first, she lit up like a happy puppy. All very good in my opinion. I can hardly wait for March and a Gold membership.

[J66R]

02/18/2014 at 1:50 am

I have had similar issues with my wife for a while, once the submission affirmation started taking effect. But, I learned that what she often was doing was seeking permission to do what she already knew needed to be done but was asking detailed questions to make sure she was doing it how I wanted. I had to walk a fine line with telling her to do what she thought was best. I had to reaffirm that I needed her to ask EVERY TIME there was a question. But to go and do it how she wanted if I gave her permission. It took a couple of months to stick, but seems to have. She now comes to me with questions on everything and asks what I think. But when I tell her to do what she thinks is best, she goes and just does.

For example I have had a tough, busy work week last week. The Washer and dryer stopped working and she asked me about what I thought. I told her that either she could see if it could be fixed, or she could wait a couple of days and I could look at it, or we could call a repair person. She asked if she could try to fix it. I told her only if she could put it back together. Long story short, she went and looked up internet sites and found out what was wrong, then she asked me if she should order the parts. I told if she thought it would fix it yes. She ordered parts and now they work. Not only that but she actually made me breakfast after that so she didn’t get too much of the “big head”.

So, I think you are on the right track. Make sure she understand you need to be asked, and it pleases you when she asks, but that you trust her to do the right thing and when she makes decisions you agree with, when you give her that permission, it pleases you even more.

That seems to be the way it is working here.
I

[gtbear]

02/18/2014 at 5:21 am

I had to go back and re-read all the scripts I had been fooling with and the ones that have been playing since the ninth of Feb. I went back over my records of when she was exposed to which scripts and found that just before the latest (9 Feb.) pair of scripts, Love You Husband -Sledge and My Husband Is My Master started, for about a day, she was exposed to the Submissive Thoughts -Wife script along with LHO. Those scripts were removed from play on the evening of the 9th of Feb. That is very little exposure for some pretty serious results. I doubt that it was anywhere near enough to become close to permanent. I am thinking that in March I’ll be customizing My Husband is my Master and His Happyness and Submissive Thoughts to make up her next play list.

I continue to be absolutely shocked by some of the changes that I am seeing. Easy does it… It’s sort of hard to forsee these things and they always seem to catch me by supprise. I am looking forward to March and April.

[gtbear]

02/19/2014 at 11:40 pm

Just a quick note: Today, when I got up, C was sitting in the living room (where the stereo is playing the subs) watching tv and fiddling with her facebook stuff. I waked through the living room on my way to the kitchen/dining room and was greeted by several I love you statements. She dropped everything and came in to get me a cup of coffee (more I love you’s) and then started back to the living room ostensibly to vacuum the carpet. I casually told her, as she sailed by, to not get out the vacuum and and that I would prefer her to come in, sit down and keep me company at the table. For a few moments she kept heading for the vacuuming then turned on her heals, came to the table, sat down and sweetly kept me company while I sipped coffee and woke up. She stayed at it until I moved on to other things and then moved back to getting the vacuuming done. Three months ago she would have egnored that or become crabby (frustrated) about having her direction changed.

I have been testing responses to mildly delivered commands in day to day actions and have noticed that if I just make a flat statement of what I want her to do, often indirectly, then simply move on with what I am doing, C will hesitate for a short time and then happily choose to do whatever it is that I instructed. This behavior is improving day by day with shorter lapses between statements (commands) and compliance. She is smiling at me at every given oppurtunity and is calm and happy in my presence.
Another little thing I am doing is telling C to present her breasts to me when I am in the mood. That used to get a lot of resistance but has fallen into the catagory of the type of complience that is happening above.

[eldrin81]

02/20/2014 at 2:48 am

Sounds good man. Glad to hear the affection and tentative attitude is improving. A lot of times that is th best part, the subs reminding them how much they loved us before a myriad of bad attitudes took root. You may have a more susceptible wife than most. And the breast play one is usually an easy win, and might be a gateway to other naughty behaviors. Qwerty used it kinda like that, read his journal some.

[gtbear]

02/20/2014 at 5:27 am

eldrin,

I have been reading and have read every post up here at least once. That doesn’t mean I retain ’em all. I go back and re-read as a way of killing time instead of adjusting scripts. Seems to be working for me.

Another little adjustment is C has started to use the occasional ‘bad’ word about sexual subjects or agrivating situations… It seems sorta like she is dipping her toes in the pool to test the water temp. Sorta cute and not really vulgar. Kinda childishly and tentitively.

Yet another thing I’ve been working on is her aversion to being told she is a “good girl”. It’s a phrase she associated with being a slave girl and the term came up, to my supprise, as a strong point of resistance (ref: early minor rebellion). Today she was bending over a counter in the kitchen and I couldn’t resist grabing her butt. She arched her back and smiled at me. I leaned in to her ear and breathed the frase “good girl” and instead of hearing something irritated come out of her mouth, I got a nice wiggle and grin from her. My Husband is My Master is really starting to show results. It’s like there has been a turning point in her resistance levels. Still minor stuff but huge progress to me.

I hope I am, with much advise from you and others here, still on just laying an attitudenal foundation which will make some of the more difficult changes to come more easily accepted. Growing her trust and rekindling her submissive nature. Anything beyond that is icing on the cake. (there’s been a lot of icing lately!)

[eldrin81]

02/20/2014 at 6:27 pm

I think you are going to be fine on the patience front. You are seeing a lot of little behavior changes that are obvious to you and keep you satisfied in knowing it is working and you are on the right track. That is a big part of helping patience, is seeing clear evidence the script is working towards a positive end, even if its small stuff. It helps condition you to keep on truckin as long as you keep up the good work on keeping excitement reigned in.

[gtbear]

02/20/2014 at 8:47 pm

Seeing changes in C has made this subliminal script thing very much worth the effort and it is part of maintaining some semblance of patience. What has really been of most value to me is reading and re-reading this and the other threads in this forum. I will be forever grateful to everyone that has posted on any of them. Seeing other folks go through the process and seeing their mistakes and successes is and has been a mainstay for me.

[eldrin81]

02/20/2014 at 11:34 pm

The forums, especially the Gold Forums and Journals, is really more of a support group than a simple forum. A support group for lost men who want to retake their marriage and guide it towards happier shores for both.

[xythont]

02/21/2014 at 4:25 am

@eldrin81 said:

The forums, especially the Gold Forums and Journals, is really more of a support group than a simple forum. A support group for lost men who want to retake their marriage and guide it towards happier shores for both.

The overwhelming truth of this statement cannot be overstated.

[gtbear]

02/21/2014 at 7:54 pm

I had a reply all ready to go but hit the wrong button and lost it. The jist was that, this forum and process has added foucus (on C’s mental status) by me that was lacking over the last few years. Perhaps that is what she was refering to early on when she said my attitude towards her had changed.

Yesterday, in an appreciative moment for something she was doing for me, as part of a complement to her, I said something along these lines, ‘your master is very pleased with you’. As it started to sink in to me what had tumbled from my mouth, C paused, both verbally and in what she was doing, then after a moment just beamed a very happy smile at me and almost curtsied. Life is good.

[gtbear]

02/23/2014 at 10:20 pm

Yesterday included a small bump back on the use of ‘good girl’. I am going to back off of that term for now and substitute something else. It is semantics. Same meaning and same usage with a different word / phrase is totally accepted. Go figure…

C woke up not feeling good this morning which made her crabby. She was in the process of firmly planding herself for doing nothing when I let her know that she had forgotten something I had told her to pick up at the store yesterday. Me; “C you forgot my whatever at the store yesterday”. C; “It can wait until tomorrow.” Me; “I need it by noon today. You will need to have it here by then.” C; “I don’t want to go out.” Me; no reply. C; 10 minutes later she was preparing to go get my whatever and had it here by noon. Going out, she was crabby but upon her return was back to being sweet and lovable.

Small question, is there a simple way to download all the silver scripts and their text files at once or do I have to do it one at a time? When I go to gold I want them to be accessable to me. It would save a lot of time if they were in a group zip file or something.

[gtbear]

02/23/2014 at 10:27 pm

Since I have the Silver membership, when I upgrade to Gold will I still have access to all the Silver scripts etc. or not. If so, then downloading all the scripts is not necessary.

[xythont]

02/23/2014 at 10:46 pm

Gold, silver, and platinum are all separate. You won’t lose access to Silver materials due to upgrade.

[gtbear]

02/25/2014 at 9:48 pm

Gold is calling me… It’s the sirens song.

This morning, C had awoke with a very short temper and ended up yelling at me about some inane thing. It’s been 2 days coming on and I think it may be related to something from her past. A date of something that tramatized her back when. She has not had a really bad anger event since I started her on subs. and this one, although compareitively mild, left her appoligizing and saying she had no idea why she was acting / feeling that way. I wonder if it is something of a push back from listening to the subs. but at the moment there is no way to tell. I think that perhaps I should give her a break for a few days and start up again in March with the first of the then to be modified scripts. Not sure exactly… leave the existing ones on unbroken or give her a short rest?

[trainer81]

02/25/2014 at 10:07 pm

Stay the course!

Don’t stop playing them. Maybe change them, depending on what your playlist is. What is she listening to now?

I love His Happiness Sledge. Highly encouraged if not using it already. Arguments that went on for days disappeared after I had my wife on that. I don’t even play it anymore, but we never have long drawn out battles anymore.

[eldrin81]

02/25/2014 at 11:20 pm

Pushback is normal. Stay the course. Review your journal, up until this incident things seemed to be going quite well. Don’t kneejerk into a script change or playlist change over one incident. As far as a break, your scripts need repetitions to work, lots of them, over the course of a month or more, so a break is not a good idea and I don’t know anyone here that intentionally gives their wives layoffs from scripts. Fizbin has to because of his traveling, but if you ask him I’m sure he will tell you it has prolonged things than if he was able to go full immersion on his wife.

[trainer81]

02/26/2014 at 12:23 am

Find where your “base” is. I started with the converter. From there I tried a bunch of different things that didn’t seem to work all that well. Every time I was unsure, I went back to the converter. I wanted her subconscious to at least get used to the idea of the files. I finally settled on His Happiness and WCS, mainly because it worked. That was my base for a long time.

I think my current custom is a new base for her now. I’m about ready to step it up to something else.

Anyway, IMO, unless she is going through some severe physical pain, I would play files every single day without fail. If you don’t know what to play, play the converter. But give His Happiness a try, I think it’s a fantastic starter file.

[Tap]

02/26/2014 at 2:40 am

I think a good base for everyone should be some kind of submissive oriented file. His Happiness is a decent base. If you can make a custom, then you can customize it to how you want it. I would always include this base file with any other subliminal you want, and go back to this base file often.

Any kind of behavior, actions, you want out of your wife have to start from a good basis so setting the ground level of obedience and submissiveness is important.

[eldrin81]

02/26/2014 at 3:10 am

Generally, we are trying to mold our wives and get them to treat us better. So yes the His Happiness and submission type scripts really are the foundation. Those take many forms however. For instance those two themes are wrapped up neatly in my custom slave girl script.

[gtbear]

02/26/2014 at 5:19 am

Thanks for the great support everyone. I believe I have a grip (yet again)…

Now and still playing I Love You Husband Sledge and My Husband is My Master. I’ll keep them playing 24/7 for now. Guess I just freaked out over the totally unexpected bad behavior. In March, with Gold membership, I’ll modify My Husband is My Master and use the finished script as a base that sticks around ad nausium or perhaps there’s something up there that will work even better (like elderin’s custom or others. As it is now, these 2 scripts have been playing 24/7 since the Feb. 9th or 10th and played for at least a week in early January. My husband is my master has been on just about every play list since the start, nearly 2 months ago. The his happyness script is going to be on the March agenda in one form or another.

I am pretty sure now that this is a ‘push back’ on having to relinquish responsibility/power in several areas. Also the second script uses the term ‘slave’ quite a bit… Anyway, the reason I think that is so, although not really directed at me since this morning, is because the girl has been being very bossy with the dog (on his case and crabby) and changing the dog rules etc. I know that may sound funny but it looks symptomatic to me. Like trying to let the crap roll down hill or testing to see just where the limit of her athority in the house is at… If she doesn’t have a grip on this by tomorrow it will require a gentle intervention by me to preserve the dog’s sanity. C has done a few other (very minor) things to assert some simblance of not putting up with any crap but still presented her breasts when she was told to. Here’s hoping the nanites will carry the day!

[gtbear]

02/26/2014 at 11:56 pm

It is afternoon following the anger episode yesterday afternoon / evening. C has been a bit skitish and petulant (determined not to smile and a little nippy) but has settled down substantially. The dog is skittish but unharmed and I have recovered my composure. There was a bit more getting after the dog this morning but she instantly dropped it when I told her to stop it. She was up at 4 am. and stayed up since. She says it was just due to joints bothering her but I suspect it was mental turmoil (the scripts are playing away right by the bed and in the living room and permiate the house). So far, Nanites=1, C=0. We seem to be oozing back to proper behavior and attitude.

3 months ago an episode like this would have taken a week of crap to shake out and would have escolated far beyond where it did. I think I was reacting to that sort of emotional explosion without it actually happening. Like ducking when you hear distant thunder… In the future I will not be so easily thrown for a loop. It is an insite for me into just how far and how much remains to be done in both of our evolving development.

[eldrin81]

02/27/2014 at 12:11 am

It’s hard to give up control when you have had it. She is not powerless, she simply must defer to you in all things. If she cooks for you for instance, she can exert creative control over that, unless you have some strict dietary guidelines. If she has hobbies she is still free to so what she wishes with that. Make sure you reward her when she does well,beyond simply being rewarded with knowing she has pleased you. The difference being, your reward comes after she has done well, not before with the expectation she will pay YOU back. That’s how a lot of us got into a sexless mess.

[eldrin81]

02/27/2014 at 12:15 am

A little aside about my own experience. My wife has these same outlets as well. Before I used to complain about her griping about work and general complaining about it. It’s usually rather whiney, and smacks of defeatist attitude and being pissy about things she lacks control over. When she is being a good girl and submissive to me, I listen to her hogwash whining about work, it’s kinda like an outlet where she feels some control, like she knows better than them. Best not to plug up all the outlets your girl has, they need some, just make sure the outlets aren’t directed at you or destructive.

[gtbear]

02/27/2014 at 5:57 am

eldrin,

I think I get that. Men blow off steam by going to the bar and getting into trouble or going fishing (death to fish!) or removing themselves from human contact and letting the emotion/stress subside. Women blow off steam by talking out their emotions (emotional talk). Men think about solutions to problems. Women just want to let it out and be done with it. Generally, it is not good for men to listen to these sorts of emotional talks because men want to fix what’s wrong (stresses you out). Women do not want it fixed, they just want to let off the steam as in a relief valve action. (there, all better now)

C has several avenues to let off steam. Yelling at me is not going to be one of them and highly charged emotional outbursts are not going to workout well for her. The promise of every carrot carries a potential reminder of the stick. In your case, the stick is not being a good girl and so not being able to blow off steam as needed. Your carrot is the reward of emotional talk to blow off stress.

I will put some serious thought into what would make effective carrots and sticks for C. She presently has what I would think of as many carrots but I suspect she has forgotten (at least a little) that those are in fact carrots. On the stick side, crude or rough will not do if this is to remain the ‘gentle way’. As I sit here, thinking about sticks, I realize that other than my expressed displeasure or removing some potential goodie, there really is not much pushing her. I’ll need to ponder some motivational drivers / handles / gripping points / push points / sharp sticks / that will enhance the carrot effect. We willl see…

[gtbear]

02/27/2014 at 6:12 am

Post Script to Carrot and Stick above:

Perhaps, if I can just be patient enough, over time the subliminals will provide the stick from the inside out… that would be nice and now that I think about it, it’s pretty much what I am hoping will happen. C would be providing her own sticks and most of her own carrots.

I will be patient. I will be patient. I will be patient… etc.

[eldrin81]

02/27/2014 at 1:04 pm

@gtbear said:

eldrin,

I think I get that. Men blow off steam by going to the bar and getting into trouble or going fishing (death to fish!) or removing themselves from human contact and letting the emotion/stress subside. Women blow off steam by talking out their emotions (emotional talk). Men think about solutions to problems. Women just want to let it out and be done with it. Generally, it is not good for men to listen to these sorts of emotional talks because men want to fix what’s wrong (stresses you out). Women do not want it fixed, they just want to let off the steam as in a relief valve action. (there, all better now)

C has several avenues to let off steam. Yelling at me is not going to be one of them and highly charged emotional outbursts are not going to workout well for her. The promise of every carrot carries a potential reminder of the stick. In your case, the stick is not being a good girl and so not being able to blow off steam as needed. Your carrot is the reward of emotional talk to blow off stress.

I will put some serious thought into what would make effective carrots and sticks for C. She presently has what I would think of as many carrots but I suspect she has forgotten (at least a little) that those are in fact carrots. On the stick side, crude or rough will not do if this is to remain the ‘gentle way’. As I sit here, thinking about sticks, I realize that other than my expressed displeasure or removing some potential goodie, there really is not much pushing her. I’ll need to ponder some motivational drivers / handles / gripping points / push points / sharp sticks / that will enhance the carrot effect. We willl see…

You are exactly correct. Women need to talk about things. Guys sometimes do as well, but we typically deal by DOING stuff. Working on a car/computer, lifting weights, whatever. Letting her blow off steam is good, as long as she doesn’t direct the emotion AT you. My wife doesn’t do that anymore, she just talks about work, and I listen, provided she is being a good girl.

Always think of ways to positively reinforce/reward behavior outside subliminals, to help support the subs. An article I think Tap posted, read that reinforcing the behavior as soon as it is done is best, along with follow ups. So if she say, presents her breasts, as soon as you are finished with sex/breast play, then give her some positive reinforcement. It could be lavish praise, it could be oral for her, it could be whatever you do just for HER. If she does stuff for several days, do something romantic for her or fun, and make it known you are doing this BECAUSE, and only because she has been so good lately.

[trainer81]

02/27/2014 at 2:22 pm

If you get the “understand my thirst” scene from White Men Can’t Jump, then you’ve gone a long way towards understanding women. When I first saw the movie (as a single college guy), I thought it was the dumbest scene in the movie. Then I saw it again with my wife and she was like, “That’s it. That’s all you need to know about women right there.”

Can’t believe I can’t find a free clip of the video anywhere. Here’s the transcript:

Gloria: Honey? My mouth is dry. Honey. I’m thirsty.

Billy: Umm… [ Water Runs ] There you go. honey.

Gloria: When I said I was thirsty, it doesn’t mean I want a glass of water.

Billy: It doesn’t?

Gloria: You’re missing the whole point of me saying I’m thirsty. If I have a problem, you’re not supposed to solve it. Men always make the mistake of thinking they can solve a woman’s problem. It makes them feel omnipotent.

Billy: Omnipotent? Did you have a bad dream?

Gloria: It’s a way of controlling a woman.

Billy: Bringing them a glass of water?

Gloria: Yes. I read it in a magazine. See… if I’m thirsty…..I don’t want a glass of water. I want you to sympathize. I want you to say. “Gloria. I. TOO. Know what it feels like to be thirsty. I. TOO. Have had a dry mouth.” I want you to connect with me through the sharing and understanding the concept of dry mouthedness.

Billy:….This is all in the same magazine?

[gtbear]

02/27/2014 at 9:22 pm

Comiseration of that kind is what ulsers and nightmares are made of. It is why hookers make money. It is the deep dark streaching from pole to pole.

I’m with Billy. WTF?

It is that sort of thing that leads to the cattleprod approach in training, and gags.

Go Nanites Go! I will be patient. I will be patient! I will be patient!

Perhaps there should be a script that makes the subs head hurt when she starts to talk like that or just forget what it was she wanted to say… or just get a really warm fuzzy feeling and need a nap. (smile face here) (or at least a smerk)

[gtbear]

02/28/2014 at 12:37 am

But on a serious note:

Today C has completely regained her former course. Totally responsive, demure, happy. Stressful things sliding off her back like rain off a duck. We continue the same two scripts but I am looking forward to March and gold scripting.

[eldrin81]

02/28/2014 at 3:10 am

Excellent.

On another Note I think one of Trainer’s old scripts had some lines to the effect of hurting when thinking too much or something. I can’t remember the exact wording.

On a serious note though, don’t put such stuff in a script. Anything Negative is usually a bad Idea.
This means negatives as in saying I do not like this thing, or negative emotions like, I hate this, or I feel bad about this etc. The former will make her focus on the wrong thing. The latter will cause too much turmoil that will be counter productive.

Some have considered a breakup script for family or friends that are destructive or abusive. Even these are typically worded in a positive manner.

[gtbear]

02/28/2014 at 5:06 am

@eldrin81 said:

Excellent.

On another Note I think one of Trainer’s old scripts had some lines to the effect of hurting when thinking too much or something. I can’t remember the exact wording. On a serious note though, don’t put such stuff in a script. Anything Negative is usually a bad Idea.
This means negatives as in saying I do not like this thing, or negative emotions like, I hate this, or I feel bad about this etc. The former will make her focus on the wrong thing. The latter will cause too much turmoil that will be counter productive.
Some have considered a breakup script for family or friends that are destructive or abusive. Even these are typically worded in a positive manner.

So, instead of “I do not like this thing” one could say something like “I love my gag” or “I like to listen more than talk” or “When master speaks I feel stress leave me” Instead of “I feel bad about this” one might add “I feel happy when I do that (as opposed to ‘this’)” or “I am refreshed, calm and happy when master is near me.” or “I am calm and happy when I am quiet”.

Verrry interesting….

[J66R]

02/28/2014 at 5:13 am

I’d agree.

I tried an experiment with inducing feeling of guilt and need to make up for a past BIG wrong.

NUCLEAR is not even a strong enough word for what happened.
Things went SIDEWAYS, CATTYWONKAS, BIG FURRY HAIRBALL, FUBAR all at once.
If it had gone on much longer she’d have probably killed the kids, ate the dog and ripped my nuts off chewed them up and spat them into MY mouth.

Quickly changing back to the regular scripts had her calmed back down in a couple of hours.

Use of negative words or imagery is a big NEGATORY!

[eldrin81]

02/28/2014 at 12:39 pm

@gtbear said:

@eldrin81 said:

Excellent.

On another Note I think one of Trainer’s old scripts had some lines to the effect of hurting when thinking too much or something. I can’t remember the exact wording. On a serious note though, don’t put such stuff in a script. Anything Negative is usually a bad Idea.
This means negatives as in saying I do not like this thing, or negative emotions like, I hate this, or I feel bad about this etc. The former will make her focus on the wrong thing. The latter will cause too much turmoil that will be counter productive.
Some have considered a breakup script for family or friends that are destructive or abusive. Even these are typically worded in a positive manner.

So, instead of “I do not like this thing” one could say something like “I love my gag” or “I like to listen more than talk” or “When master speaks I feel stress leave me” Instead of “I feel bad about this” one might add “I feel happy when I do that (as opposed to ‘this’)” or “I am refreshed, calm and happy when master is near me.” or “I am calm and happy when I am quiet”.

Verrry interesting….

Even with the word stress, I would say it is a negative term. She will focus on the word stress. Instead say,

My master speaking relaxes me.

Try to reword conditionals as well, when, if, etc. I have seen some success with them, but usually it just gives the subconscious another thing to process, so IF you can reword them, then do so.

As an interesting aside on the power of negative words. Early on, when I started here, probably the first week, I was convinced my wife was having an affair. I had a script with a line that read:

I feel sick to my stomach when I keep things from Eldrin.

Guess what happened? My subconcious IGNORED the ‘when I keep things from Eldrin” part, and I felt sick to MY stomach.

[eldrin81]

02/28/2014 at 12:44 pm

I can’t remember which thread I posted this in, but when you start writing your own scripts, an online thesaurus can be your best friend.
Whenever you have a statement that you can only figure out how to word in the negative, use a thesaurus and find the antonyms to make it positive.

Tap has a post somewhere around the forum, that lists common words that are seen as negative, negative emotion, or conditional statements.

[eldrin81]

02/28/2014 at 1:01 pm

As per my example above, I know that my subconscious is capable of ignoring statements that make no sense to it:

I want to suck Eldrin’s dick.

I have yet to experience wanting to suck my own dick from this playing, or even wanting to be a submissive/slave.
And yet in the example above, my subconscious completely ignored the conditional statement “when …”.

To be fair, I don’t think the subconscious is totally incapable of processing/hearing conditionals. I have seen some success with them, but those statements are supported by other non conditional statements. Just speculating here, but probably what happens is the subconscious has to hand the conditionals off to the higher waking brain to mull over. If there are statements for instance getting your wife to think about presenting her breasts to you, followed by a conditional statement, maybe the concious brain begins to think about these things, and then can evaluate the conditional. But in my example above, that statement was by itself, the other statements around it had to do with other topics.

But to be on the safe side, unless your script is particularly focused on triggered behavior (probably best to save such an advanced topic for later) reword your conditional statements as if they were ALWAYS true.

[seekenq]

02/28/2014 at 1:58 pm

I agree – focus relentlessly on making positive statements.
The farthest I have gone is to say undesirable behavior X is difficult or takes too much energy.
I then offset each of those statements with positive statements for the desired behavior Y.
This is not negative per se but relating X to great effort / difficulty so that it become easier / simpler to do Y
Example: Being X is difficult for me. Doing X takes too much of my energy.
Doing Y makes me feel good. I am safe and secure doing Y., Etc.

[eldrin81]

02/28/2014 at 2:03 pm

@seekenq said:

I agree – focus relentlessly on making positive statements.
The farthest I have gone is to say undesirable behavior X is difficult or takes too much energy.
I then offset each of those statements with positive statements for the desired behavior Y.
This is not negative per se but relating X to great effort / difficulty so that it become easier / simpler to do Y
Example: Being X is difficult for me. Doing X takes too much of my energy.
Doing Y makes me feel good. I am safe and secure doing Y., Etc.

I can see how that might be beneficial. I don’t see that as negative either, just a path of least resistance thing.

[gtbear]

02/28/2014 at 11:53 pm

I and anyone else that reads these last posts and even the whole thread, will have gained a lot of insight into the workings of the subconsious brain. Thanks.

Today, I told C that I am upgrading to Gold Membership here. She asked me “why” and I told her, “because it is something I want to do”. She asked ‘how much does it cost” and I told her I am not sure what the final cost will be but plan on X amount and we will see if that does it.” C said, “OK” and that was pretty much it. She has become much more accepting of my withholding information from her than she was a few months ago. It is as though she hears, accepts, and dismisses the question / answer with whatever I choose to say and does not think anymore about it. Additionally, she is (very mildly) dumming down and becoming a bit of a space cadet (I find this cute on blondes) on general day to day decision making and things that she can ask me about how to do or how they work. With concentration she is still very capable of getting fairly complex things done, like bill paying / book keeping but tends more and more to stick to assigned tasks rather than look for new things to get into. This last is very suttle to me but is, I believe, the result of slowly giving up responsibility/power in areas that should not and will not be a task or concern for her. Over the last few years, I have allowed and required her to keep pretty close tabs on me. She has been having a lot of that removed from her responsibilities and is adjusting well to things like knocking and waiting for me to open doors so that I am not interupted with what I am up to. Prior to this she was supposed to just enter and check on how I was doing (training her to do that was very difficult and she had a tough time getting used to doing it). She is asking many fewer questions about what I am up to, but is alert to my voice and responsive (although still slightly delayed) to commands. C is asking before spending money on anything outside the normal bill paying, grocery buying and things like gas for the car. If she wants something, she asks if it would be ok for her to get it. The only things she has asked about for herself have been things she thinks will please me.

C informed me today, that SHE HAS DECIDED to work very hard at not causing stressful situations or having emotional outbursts. I told her I thought that would be wise and very pleasing to me which gained a demure smile from the girl. ‘Master’ seems to be a word that she is becoming very comfortable with. My using it has no more negitive impact than does my name in conversation, commands, or comments. She has yet to use the term when speaking. ‘Slave’ is a bit more risky but is tollerated. C does not seem to have any concious knowledge or concerns about these changing behaviors and thought patterns. She is only mildy aware of the fact that the subliminals (all silents) are playing and her mind seems to skip intirely the fact that they are there 24/7 on the stereo. Considering that this whole process has only been going on for less than 2 months, I am very pleased with the results so far.

[trainer81]

02/28/2014 at 11:58 pm

Hey bud your a silver member if I’m not mistaking Go for the upgrade it will be cheaper…. Only silver members can upgrade.

Trainer81

[gtbear]

02/28/2014 at 11:59 pm

I’m on it now. Gold, here I come!

Ok… looks like that’s all done. Now for learning the ins and outs of script making and recording and all the other gold stuff. Time for the old dog to learn new trix.

[gtbear]

03/02/2014 at 11:36 am

Over the last couple of days some interesting and again suprising developments on the C front.

The same 2 scripts have been playing and are still unaltered with no new direct changes occuring.

However, during or just after our conversation about Gold membership, the girl reminded me that I had mentioned that quiting smoking (I’ve been smoking since Cigs cost 15 cents a pack) was/is part of what the subliminals are supposed to be helping with. I suggested that we take a little jaunt down to a place that sells vapor pipes / cigs to see what they have available and pick up something that will make us both happy. Next day, with C driving we set off to find the anti-smoke shop. Trafic was heavy and the shop was elusive (turns out it moved to a new location). C started getting frustrated and at one point, she had her foot on the gas when I thought it should have been on the brake. I said, “Stop!” and one arm of mine, closest to her, was raised to catch the dash should we have a fender bender. There was no accident but she looked over at me, took a deep breath and flew off the handle. Later, at the house and after about half an hour of getting a grip on emotions, she informed me that she had thought she was going to be hit by me. She said that my arm/hand was too sudden and too close to her head… Raising it was sudden but the dash is infront of us, not close to her given the confines of the car. The thought of hitting her couldn’t have been further from my mind and I told her as much, soothed her ruffled feathers and have been putting serious thought into why she would think such a thing.

After some deliberation, I think it shakes out like this, 1: her stress level was up even before we left the house due to the fact she knows that quitting smoking has not been something I am keen to do 2: The traffic was brutal and I was there watching her every move 3: the store we were looking for was missing in action (I had asked her if she knew where it was before we left the house) 4: When I said “Stop” it was in a command voice and coupled with raising the hand toward the dash, may have been a bit of an over reaction on my part. 5: C was becoming angry due to the other stressors going on and that equated, in her mind, to being a ‘bad girl’ who probably deserved to be punished (a self inflicted guilt trip). Put it all togeather and to me, it looks like a horse that has become ‘head shy’ or skittish due to sudden movements around it’s face or the jingle of spurs on aproaching boots. I am wondering if this is the first signs of C producing her own mental ‘sharp stick’. The anger reaction was intense but very short lived and when she went out for some groceries later she seemed to be in perfict confirmation. She returned with a pie for me and has been back to her sweetly lovable self ever since. Before she left on her second mission to the grocery store, I had her present her breasts for some gentle fondling and watched as the stress drained from her face and body. It is becoming a comfort to her to go through the process with her breasts. She seems to get considerable comfort from the act of obedience / submission and from the petting. (not bad for me either)

[eldrin81]

03/02/2014 at 1:55 pm

Sounds like you identified everything there perfectly. In the future, when you have your customs complete, you may want some lines about trusting you, feeling safe with you/around you, and being relaxed/happy around you.

I know my wife cannot handle much in the way of stress. She WILL fly off the handle, acting completely out of character, panicky, and unknowingly thwarting my attempts to resolve the situation by distracting me with said behavior. I have lines in place about trusting me, and feeling protected and safe around/by me etc.

Its part of the reason why I don’t bother her with finances, or anything that would be highly stressful that she has no need to worry about. I gladly carry that burden so that she doesn’t have to. It is my way of shielding and protecting her.

[eldrin81]

03/02/2014 at 2:00 pm

Part of the submission process is complete and total TRUST. You may be undermining that with the smoking, if you told her the subliminals were supposed to help with that. If she has seen no cessation in that, it was probably a hit to her trust in you. Once a small crack in trust appears, it is easy for subsequent stress and events to widen that crack and result in reactions like you described. Amidst the frustration and stress, and the distrust sprouting in her mind, it is likely why she perceived the sudden movement of your hand as scary. She indeed is acting like a spooked horse, perceiving something that doesn’t seem ‘right’ (ie your smoking) and pondering that while other stresses build up and overwhelm her.

[J66R]

03/02/2014 at 9:29 pm

Given the circumstances I think I’d tend to agree with your assessment of the stressors present and their influence.
I’d also give a bit of credence to what Eldrin said about creating conflicting states between the expectation of the subs and what is happening in reality.

There was some time ago in some threads of the forums where we all discussed at length the idea that our situations we have found ourselves in are in large part our own faults because we have unconsciously negotiated the relationships we have now. In order for us to change that dynamic we have to propose a new “contract” and if we want our wives to assume new roles, we have to change ourselves to become a matching counterpart to those new roles our wives are being expected to play by submitting to the affirmations in the subs.

In theory, in this case, if she has a conscious expectation (because you told her so) that the subs are supposed to be helping with smoking, that has become part of the “contract” her mind believes it has made with you to justify the other changes suggested in the subs. If there is not sufficient evidence to back up the idea that the change expected, not smoking, is occurring, then her subconscious mind try to rebel against her part of the contract. Breast presentation upon command would be a signal that she wants to comply, and assertion of authority brings her back into alignment, but ultimately, providing evidence you are satisfying that “contract” may be the only way to prevent such events or the breakdown of the progress.

I think that is why a number of us have decided that we will use the sub techniques not just on our wives but ourselves to help us assume the new roles that play well opposite the roles defined by the new contracts we are making with our wives. I don’t know if you have done so but, creating sub for yourself to help you stop smoking might help once it takes hold on you and she can see the progress. I know going to the shop is a good step in the right direction. But women get pretty crazy when things we intend don’t work out the way we intend. They of course do not apply the same result standard to themselves but that is actually part of the “I am a man of action so submit to me and I’ll take care of everything” contract we are kind of pushing them into. So even if the “failure” is not our fault, we have to step up and find a way to justify the elevated status we are trying to make them see us as deserving.

Not meant as a soapbox speech, just an idea, the theory I have been working under with me and my wife.

[tonguester4_69]

03/02/2014 at 11:17 pm

I agree with J66R, in that if you make a deal, or contract it does give them an out. That’s partly why my progress in sexual areas has not been all that spectacular. I’m not willing to tie her behavior, to a change in my behavior.Most of my files, apply the principle that she should be submissive, because it’s the natural order of things.That being said, there’s no doubt, that playing my files have inadvertently induced some changes n my behavior.None that I object to ,but changes nevertheless.

[Tap]

03/03/2014 at 3:46 am

I like the idea of a contract. In my marriage, we have actually written out in words on paper and signed, what she should do for me and I should do for her in return. This includes what she will do specifically sexually for me, how many times mimimum sex a month, and her cooking and cleaning duties.

It’s good to tell your wife explicitly what you expect out of your marriage. If you get more than that, great, but there always should be a base level.

[gtbear]

03/03/2014 at 7:30 am

About 5 or 6 years ago, a (to me) young and very shapely girl pretty much begged me into teaching her to be a slave. She was very sincere and very committed and actually came a long way during the time I was training her. Anyone that has done that will tell you that it is a time consuming, money and effort requiring endevor to train a slave girl and this one was no exception. When such things are a game, it is much easier, cheaper and playful than when the parties are dead serious. I suspected from the start that what she really was had little to do with service, although she was of much use to me, and more about liking pain and wanting to explore that. Because I suspected that she was basicly playing around the bdsm lifestile in an exploratory way, I required a very specific contract from her for a specific period of time. Contracts of this kind are only worth what the 2 parties are willing to make stick OR you have to have several very real and very costly ways to enforce the contract and the will power and means to do so. (for when the going gets tough) To make a long story short, the girl asked to be and was let go about 3 months early when she probably should have been run through a ringer and forced to complete her training and enter full service. The time and energy that was/is required to take a sub to a full blown well trained slave girl and what turned out to be my failing health resulted in her obtaining her wishes. It doesn’t matter what one puts in a contract if you (the master) are not willing and/or able to enforce it.

If you are dealing with your wife and developing a slave/master relationship, the stakes are near perfection in success and zero failure margin. That’s much higher than with some sub/slave that you will probably want to sell or give away eventually. Love changes things. Kids change things and life long commitment changes things. You, the master, have a lot more to loose and I firmly believe the wives are 110 percent aware of that. You are at a disadvantage in the power exchange and so probably should not negeociate a damn thing.

Part of being alpha male is being able to say, truthfully, to your self and to project to those around you, that you can and may very well, drop the relationship if it is the least bit problematic for you. That in the background there are many little lovelies that are willing and chomping at the bit to make you a happy guy. Of course, that doesn’t usually work too well most of the time for married men. I think the best one can hope for on paper would amount to an agreement… or a socially enforceable oath (like marrage vows) or just as a reminder of what was agreed to…

What most here are up to is grooming wives and girl friends to be sub-serviant and sexually pleasing. Some are reaching a little further and so are edging into a mental form of bondage by brain adjustment… thought re-alignment… behavior modification in a somewhat extended way. Others are using the subliminals to help with the attitude of serious slaves in training.

Experience tells me that subs and bdsm players are generally contract oriented (it signifies a trusting relationship of limits). Slaves have no right to any such thing and ultimately, where they are is at the pleasure of their master and they are doing what their master wants when he wants it, objections be damned. There is no ‘out’ from the relationship becouse they are bound by their minds, their financial situation, and their ankle to a life of subservience. It really doesn’t matter what they think about it, it is inescapable for many reasons and is absolute. Such stuff must be enforced by a lot more than an agreement on paper and the deeper the bondage the more one must dismantle the slave’s ability to escape their slavery. I rather doubt that such a depriciation of one’s wife is what anyone here is up to. In fact I keep hearing things along the line of “be happy, don’t worry, be safe and protected etc. in various scripts.

C is, in most ways and areas a slave girl. If I suggested to her that such is the case, she would strongly oppose, with out facts, the concept. It really dosen’t matter what she thinks about it except in so far as it affects me. On the other hand, she is my wife and so enjoys and has enjoyed a far more elevated position in my house than other slaves/subs/servants. I am in a good position when it comes to, ‘if you’ll to this then I’ll do that’ sort of negociations / agreements etc. That position is and has been (unless it pleases me to do so) I don’t feel any need to make bargans (like you get new shoes when I get laid). The way it has pretty much always gone is more like (you’ve been very pleasing lately, go get your hair done and pick up a new pair of shoes while you’re at it.)

I guess that all this blather is to explain that I didn’t / don’t think there was any ‘bargin’ struck on smoking or not. And yet… looking back on it now, quitting smoking is both good for me and her and the house and should be a carrot for her. If she was looking at it as a contract or agreement (and I believe there is some evedence to support that) then for the sake of the subliminals acceptance I can go along with that… hopefully it will speed up the process. Either way, I’m still quitting so what the hell?

[eldrin81]

03/03/2014 at 2:30 pm

I see what you are trying to say there, but I must make a few points. Many of us are trying to make our wives subservient, or into slave girls. But for instance, I myself do not define slave the same way that it has been traditionally defined, as in when it was applied to the jews in egypt, or the blacks in America. I have no desire for my wife to walk around in complete despair, feeling depressed and desperate. What I am aiming for is the submission towards me, the deference towards my will, but ultimately I want her to be happy about it. We use lines like I am happy being…, because our wives are not slaves or submissive currently, and we have to work with how they are, and they will not accept subliminals that are negative, and nor would many of us want our wives walking around defeated and sad all the time. Our definition of slavery and submission is different than the traditional, or maybe even the one in the BDSM scene, I dunno. Each of us has our own personal definition, but the general consensus I gather is one of a loving master, and a happy wife.

As far as the ‘bargin’ that may or may not have been struck, you yourself said that you had told her the subliminals were to help with the smoking. Then no evidence of such was presented to your wife, and she had an episode in which you posted here. It doesn’t matter that it wasn’t explicitly written on paper as some contract, you said it and you are her husband. Even if she is submissive or a ‘slave’ to you she expects you to be frank with her, or at least appear to be.

The idea of a submissive slave wife has a lot of parallels to government, and ideas presented by John Locke. You can only ever govern someone by their consent. Many have done so in the past through fear, and presentation of a worse alternative. We here try to ‘govern’ our wives by making it a more appealing and pleasurable experience. We rewire their perceptions such that it becomes more appealing, and thus they consent willingly with much less restraint.

So basically what I am trying to say here is that your wife, no matter how you view her, no matter what place you take her to, is always going to be a person with free will. You can diminish her sense of self, but unless you remove some of her brain, she is always going to be free thinking. You cannot completely remove her sense of self, and anyone that has demonstrated that to you in the past, has done so of their own consent, but they still possessed free will, just never expressed it. She is also your wife first and foremost, and your word to her is your bond. You saying something is happening, and then her finding out that it is not, is a break in her trust. Whether or not you care about that is your business, but it does explain behavior like you experienced, and that will probably lead to more resistance in the future.

[J66R]

03/03/2014 at 5:15 pm

I think Eldrin said what I was meaning better than I did. Hopefully I can do better this time.

Essentially ALL relationships are negotiated in one way or another. One person may have an advantage of some sort (real or imagined) in the negotiations, to obtain more favorable terms for their part of the relationship, but the relationship IS ALWAYS negotiated. No matter the relationship dynamic, both parties can leave, even if it is by self inflicted damage, or becoming so unruly as to be unbearable. Once the stakes of the bargain reach the outside limits of one party’s tolerance, the contract is (perceived) broken and misbehavior or punishment begins. This also is part of the bargain because at some point the controller will release control because the drawbacks outweigh the benefits, or the controlled will rebel in some way (leaving, asserting independence, finding a stronger controller, suicide) when the controller steps far enough outside the bounds or doesn’t provide what the controlled expected.

The perception of absolute control is generally just that, perception, by the controller or controlled. But even the perception is negotiated. It doesn’t matter if the controller thinks it is one sided or not, the controlled has determined to allow the control. The difference is nearly always relativistic. And yes I mean it in the literal Einsteinian sense. It depends on the frame of reference of the controlled, not the controller. We can frame the situation to make the controlled think there is nothing they can do about it, but we, as the controllers, need to understand clearly that is not the case. This is one of the reasons we are running these subs on the women more heavily than on ourselves. Women, I think, often have an innate sense of this control dynamic even if they do not consciously know and use it. Otherwise there would never be any issue about dominance as they tend to be less aggressive and physically weaker than their men as well as less adept at logic and planning.

But, I wasn’t trying to imply there is NO control or that in every case there was a written (or verbal) contract such as Tap mentioned or that negotiations were formal. I, in fact started my marriage with explicit verbal agreements between myself and my wife that were made during what I thought were long and serious talks about our future which actually involved both of us expressing verbally that we agree to do, say think such-and-such. Ours were not written and signed though so there was no tangible proof and as soon as she was in a situation that made her question the fairness of an agreement she recanted and eventually convinced herself that either she didn’t agree or that I had mislead her into agreeing so they were invalid. I did have a journal at the time where I chronicled the agreements made by each of the women I considered for marriage. Unfortunately, she never accepted those as proof, and later when we went our religious leaders for marriage counseling, he advised me to get rid of it because I would only become bitter and disappointed at the differences between my expectations and reality. Like a sheeple, I did and have regretted it since.

But back on topic, I was merely implying that the very nature of beings is that one has no control over the other without some sort of acceptance of the control by the controlled even if the acceptance is based on misperception of fact or option.

[MasterSouthernStar]

03/03/2014 at 7:51 pm

Eldrin;

Your examination of the slave dynamic is excellent – especially in that you recognize there are an infinite number of options for that relationship path. I would agree that most of us here do not want the classic BDSM Master Slave relationship as described on all those websites. For myself I want her to be without self, with minimal will but most importantly with a gigantic pleasure in her circumstance. That is the ” I am happy” doing such and so – or doing such and so “feels good” in all the scripts. Eliminating self IS the basis of the slavery life and as hard as it is to actually do, it’s been my experience that most of the people ( both male and female) who come to that place benefit greatly from achieving the highest level of self less ness that they can. For my girl I know that losing the self she was will make her delirious. And that’s what I’m working for.

I think all the other guys here are in similar situations and all any of us want is to live with someone who is not UNhappy all the time – because that’s a real bummer.

MSS

[gtbear]

03/03/2014 at 8:58 pm

Eldrin,

I take your points. There is, in light of the subconcious mind and the diet of subliminals, a lot that has to be carefully stated in whatever venue is up at the moment. In the past I have been more inclined to have the sub adjust to me and my thought process than vs-a-vs. I suppose that it all boils down to where you are coming from and where you are going in the relationship. One of the differences between myself and most others here is that I don’t have to do anything that I don’t want to do (like go to work) and C is not being used to make extra $ either, although in the past she has held jobs. Now it’s all centered around the home.

What was it Janis Joplin sang?…”fredom’s just another word for nothin left to loose” I think she was more than a bit off the mark in this context.

I understand the concept of ‘free will’ but still define it a bit differently (yet we do have our points of agreement) still, I doubt that there is such a thing for subs or slaves particularly when that free thought process is being manipulated by hypnosis or subliminals introduced by us to them specifically to alter the views they already hold. Don’t get me wrong… I do like this most subtle form of slavery and the better it works the more I like it. (for all the reasons you mention) and more. It seems that the words”will” and ‘freewill’ are being used as being the same thing but to me they are not the same. As and example: C is allowed to think. C believes that she can think what she wants to think. C wants to think what I tell her to think. C thinks the thoughts that I have placed in her skull and has the resultant opinions and actions and feelings…. That is will, but I am having a hard time calling it free.

Trainer mentioned Trust as his primary objective in training his girl. It looks like C may have read more into the ‘quit smoking’ statement than I did. Like putting a time limit on it… (like really doing it now not later… like that was the primary purpose of the subliminals…) I’ll be holding myself to it but will be very careful in the future not to make statements like that. So, thanks for the input. As always, it is much appreciated.

[gtbear]

03/03/2014 at 10:23 pm

@J66R said:

I think Eldrin said what I was meaning better than I did. Hopefully I can do better this time.

Essentially ALL relationships are negotiated in one way or another. One person may have an advantage of some sort (real or imagined) in the negotiations, to obtain more favorable terms for their part of the relationship, but the relationship IS ALWAYS negotiated. No matter the relationship dynamic, both parties can leave, even if it is by self inflicted damage, or becoming so unruly as to be unbearable. Once the stakes of the bargain reach the outside limits of one party’s tolerance, the contract is (perceived) broken and misbehavior or punishment begins. This also is part of the bargain because at some point the controller will release control because the drawbacks outweigh the benefits, or the controlled will rebel in some way (leaving, asserting independence, finding a stronger controller, suicide) when the controller steps far enough outside the bounds or doesn’t provide what the controlled expected.

The perception of absolute control is generally just that, perception, by the controller or controlled. But even the perception is negotiated. It doesn’t matter if the controller thinks it is one sided or not, the controlled has determined to allow the control. The difference is nearly always relativistic. And yes I mean it in the literal Einsteinian sense. It depends on the frame of reference of the controlled, not the controller. We can frame the situation to make the controlled think there is nothing they can do about it, but we, as the controllers, need to understand clearly that is not the case. This is one of the reasons we are running these subs on the women more heavily than on ourselves. Women, I think, often have an innate sense of this control dynamic even if they do not consciously know and use it. Otherwise there would never be any issue about dominance as they tend to be less aggressive and physically weaker than their men as well as less adept at logic and planning.

But, I wasn’t trying to imply there is NO control or that in every case there was a written (or verbal) contract such as Tap mentioned or that negotiations were formal. I, in fact started my marriage with explicit verbal agreements between myself and my wife that were made during what I thought were long and serious talks about our future which actually involved both of us expressing verbally that we agree to do, say think such-and-such. Ours were not written and signed though so there was no tangible proof and as soon as she was in a situation that made her question the fairness of an agreement she recanted and eventually convinced herself that either she didn’t agree or that I had mislead her into agreeing so they were invalid. I did have a journal at the time where I chronicled the agreements made by each of the women I considered for marriage. Unfortunately, she never accepted those as proof, and later when we went our religious leaders for marriage counseling, he advised me to get rid of it because I would only become bitter and disappointed at the differences between my expectations and reality. Like a sheeple, I did and have regretted it since.

But back on topic, I was merely implying that the very nature of beings is that one has no control over the other without some sort of acceptance of the control by the controlled even if the acceptance is based on misperception of fact or option.

I think I am starting to see a common and fundamental hick-up in logic here that I wasn’t recognizing before. When I say ‘all’ or ‘every’ or ‘always’ etc. that extends out through my own frame of reference and I would guess that the same is true of you. Our bodies of knowledge have some common threads but much is very different. An example of this might be how you and I selected our wives and how the relationship / marrage has developed in a controlled or uncontroled way.
C had been in my sights since we were young teenagers. There was much I found attractive about her and she liked my looks too. As the years passed we only occasionally had much of anything contact wise but still kept up the occasional letter or whatever. I was home on leave from a foregin country (in the military) and decided that it was time to get married. I got her out on a date and as that evening was ending, I told her we were getting married (or else) and she capitulated without argument or discussion. I knew who she was and decided that was the one after observing her for several years.

I guess one could call that a negociation… but I don’t see how it would be. I say go and they go. I say come here and they come here… I have ever been accustomed to that. It would be nice if ‘they’ were happy about that but it is unnecessary to my purposes.

Was it Led Zeplin’s “stairway to heaven” that had backmasked “the decieved do not know that they are decieved” into the recording? To have been decieved is something that happens to us all. To choose to remain so is beyond me. To not correct the issue/s and live unhappily with the results of the deception? I can see where that could be very frustrating.

Just throwing this out for your consideration; since it seems you are now using the sublims to hold your girl to her previous vows/promises could it be acceptable to remake your ‘lost list’ and use that as a future goal list to work on with the subliminals? Have you already done that? I can see where that might make for a series of very satisfying success stories, like stepping stones on the way to her enslavement. Just say’in…

[J66R]

03/04/2014 at 5:48 am

I’m not for sure our experiences were all that different. But I do think our goals are.

A lot of our experiences in the beginning are similar.
I realized at one point that women would do anything I wanted, all I needed to do was tell them they were going to. They responded, and if they didn’t I didn’t need the hassle of dealing with it, there were too many others willing and even eager to be what I wanted. I can even point to my military service and deciding that of all the others this was the one. I told her very early in the relationship that she would marry me. Very quickly she agreed. A huge part of my selecting her was that she fully capitulated willingly and eagerly to nearly everything I said. In retrospect, even though I constantly spoke to her of my philosophy of partnership (which I’ll describe below), and asked very in depth questions and had long discussions after she agreed to marry me, to make sure she understood precisely what I wanted needed and expected, I think she was full on bowled over by this very aggressive, bold, blunt, alpha male, who was so cock sure of himself and knew exactly what he wanted. She saw girls literally gasp themselves into delirium if I merely spoke to them and made physical contact. It was a real “I can’t believe HE wants ME. I’d better now screw this up because he’ll choose someone else if I don’t go along” kind of thing.

I think though my goals for a marriage might have been significantly different:
I think the one difference between our experiences was that I was not necessarily looking for full blind subordination and subservience. I was looking for a fully contributing partner that had the intelligence, and will to help fill in the areas that I might not be able to, but still be able to submit to my authority. The idea being that no matter the lingo used, when two people enter a relationship one is ultimately dominate and the other subordinate. There has to be, because two individuals with different experiences, no matter their training will not always come to the same conclusion, so one has to take precedence. In my view, my wife’s knowledge, intelligence, opinions and life experiences are to be given freely to me to augment my own. I should honestly evaluate them and their applicability to a given situation and then I make the decision. It is her responsibility to honestly present her “gifts” mentioned above to the common good for me to evaluate and decide how they are to be integrated into my own, applied to a problem or disregarded. I do not begrudge vigorous advocacy by her of her opinions, but once the decision is final, that’s it. It then becomes her job to accept that I have been completely honest and have evaluated her contribution correctly. And if I decide something in favor of her view and not my initial view, she should acknowledge my generosity in accepting her view. If I decide to split the difference in some way taking part of hers and part of mine, then she should acknowledge the wisdom of the blended solution. And if I choose to discard her contributions completely and decide completely and wholly my way, she should be comforted that I did consider her input but that I made the correct decision to move on without it. In any case, regardless of my decision and whose input contributed the most to the final decision, it becomes her priority to make the decision hers. She is to believe it, adopt it and carry out her part in the solution just as if it was all her idea anyway. At that point the submission is complete. No ifs, ands, or buts. We were to then put on a fully integrated and united front to the world and in our own home and in private.

Though I was a thoroughbred out of the starting gate I flubbed it on the first turn:

I still think that everything would have been OK, but I made a fatal mistake. Once we were married, I toned down the APLHAness in an attempt to make her transition to our new life easier. young girl, barely 20, zero life experience, suddenly 500 miles from home knowing she’ll only see her family once a year or so from now on. I backed off of the whole requiring complete giving and trust thing trying to be compassionate. What I should have done was remain the one constant in her life. She would likely have made it fine if I had stayed the same and gave her what she married me to give her. Uncompromising and honest authority from a position of power. I so bailed on her without meaning to because I didn’t understand the whole “contract” thing.

Now that brings me to the whole “contract” thing. Simply put a slave agrees to be a slave, whether you or I know it or acknowledge it:
Maybe it doesn’t always happen like, “Hey girl, you’d make a good slave, in fact you’d make me a good slave. On your knees and suck girl. Ah yeah, that’s a good girl. Harder faster, harder faster!” But then maybe it does work that way with some women.

It’s just plain human psychology. I dealt with this stuff in my service days, with some of the shops I had to work in or in collaboration with. Everything is a contract. If you can take advantage of certain aspects of their personalities or situations to reframe their perception so that the situation you want them in becomes more palatable than the most likely other situation, you have control. But, you have to reframe or insinuate yourself into a current frame in order to gain that control. Some people are easy to identify as having those submissive qualities, others are not so submissive, either due to inherent traits or societal programming. But in the end, the slave agrees to be your slave as long as you provide something the slave thinks they need. For some it is absolution of responsibility, for others it is punishment, for others it is the whole daddy figure thing and for others it could be true mental illness. The same can be said for the masters. Some act out what they wish they had had (or did have) as role models, others seek retribution for some wrong (real or imagined) by the person subjugated or by someone the slave represents. And still others are just sick twisted SOBs. And on both sides each might chose some version of submissive or dominate lifestyle because to them it just makes sense. But in every case it is just human nature, free will if you want to put a name to it, that they are getting “something” out of it. Maybe you don’t know they’re getting something out of it. Maybe you don’t know what that is they get out of it. Maybe you don’t care if they are getting something out of it or not. But, really, your frame of reference is irrelevant. All that matters is her frame of reference. She has to think she is getting something whether we think so or care. Otherwise, and here is the tie-in to all of it, why in the heck would any of us be putting things like “I love to XXX” or “I want to XXX” or “doing XXX makes me YYY” or “It is my idea to XXX”? Look at every script, from those of us who are all moon eyed over our women trying to “change their frame of reference” so they can be happy, love us more, get excited by doing things for us or to love being subservient, to feel safe knowing they don’t have to make decisions, to feel independent by choosing dependence. Then look at those of us that perceive the relationship a bit more one sided, and you’ll still see parts of the script that describe some sort of reward she gets by complying with the affirmations.

Now again, I am not trying to force my belief of what the perfect relationship should be on you. Nor am I attempting to say my view of the perfect marriage is better functionally or morally. I’m speaking only to the concept of how relationships are formed and why. Having worked many years ago in close proximity to some of the people who developed very effective methods of influencing both individuals and masses of people, I recognized the pattern and the structure of what we are doing here as very similar to what they were doing. And I’ll tell you, this “contract theory” was (I might add still is) the basic working theory that they construct(ed) their experiments and operations using. The way it was explained to me back then, was that until they realized that it was all a matter of making sure a subject felt they were getting the best available terms in an “agreement”, success was largely due to the intuition of whoever designed a campaign. Now that they came to understand it in this way, formally, and not just a “make it hurt worse the other way” kind of thing, it is a science and the results are reproducible, as long as you follow the rules of the “contract”.

[J66R]

03/04/2014 at 6:22 am

And to you question about “stepping stones”.
I have, in a sense, reconstituted the “list” and will use those as goals.

But I have no intention of developing my wife into a “slave”.
Use her body for my pleasure, absolutely. But I would like for her to get some of that back too.
Have her submit to anything I ask, heck yeah. But if she is right an I am wrong, I will change my view to be right.
Now I fully realize that much of what I want in a relationship, as described in one of the spoilers, in the post above, would be considered slavery by some people, though it is just logic to me.

So to many people, I AM trying to enslave my wife.

But, I want something else as well. I want everything she knows and is, to be available to me in living life, taking care of my family as if it were actually a part of me. That means I cannot dismiss all she actually knows that I do not, the experiences she has had that I have not and all she is wiser in than I am in. I just have to be honest and wise enough to discern when that is to give my endeavors and those of my family the greatest chance of success.

[xythont]

03/04/2014 at 3:13 pm

This. This post right here. This is the most like my viewpoint and goals. I’m not sure where I’ll be at later on, but this rings very true for me.

@J66R said:

And to you question about “stepping stones”.
I have, in a sense, reconstituted the “list” and will use those as goals.

But I have no intention of developing my wife into a “slave”.
Use her body for my pleasure, absolutely. But I would like for her to get some of that back too.
Have her submit to anything I ask, heck yeah. But if she is right an I am wrong, I will change my view to be right.
Now I fully realize that much of what I want in a relationship, as described in one of the spoilers, in the post above, would be considered slavery by some people, though it is just logic to me.

So to many people, I AM trying to enslave my wife.

But, I want something else as well. I want everything she knows and is, to be available to me in living life, taking care of my family as if it were actually a part of me. That means I cannot dismiss all she actually knows that I do not, the experiences she has had that I have not and all she is wiser in than I am in. I just have to be honest and wise enough to discern when that is to give my endeavors and those of my family the greatest chance of success.

[trainer81]

03/04/2014 at 4:55 pm

I’ve seen some rather amusing arguments about this on BDSM forums and blogs, as far as what constitutes a submissive or slave.

One could certainly make the case that if a wife completely submits all household decision making to the husband, then that is a type of slavery. My own investigation into real “slave” lifestyles (via books/blogs etc.) indicates that the most successful of these arrangements are the ones where the husband has all the decision-making power, but encourages and values input from his wife on certain matters, as well as designating certain other decisions to her entirely. In the end, she may disagree with his decision, but she always submits to it. Honestly, this isn’t very far off from where I want to be.

A couple weekends ago, my wife did submit to a decision I made, even though she was opposed. The local weather had finally warmed up a bit and we were going out on a family hike. The place we had chosen to go to turned out to be closed, so I suggested another spot, but my wife said she just wanted to go home. This used to happen quite a bit – if our plans didn’t work out, she just wanted to quit. I must have given her a look, because she immediately retracted and said she’d do whatever I wanted. I said we would go to the other place for a hike.

Now, she had also mentioned that morning that she wasn’t feeling great, and I thought it had to do with the weather and being cooped up. She did mention it again when she said she wanted to go home, but I initially dismissed it. As we were driving to the second hike, I reached over and ran my hand along the side of her face and realized she was MUCH warmer than usual, and after a more careful sideways glance at her, I decided she was rather pale. So instead of continuing on my initial decision, I told her that I was worried about her and that we would go back home and just walk around the neighborhood a bit, but that we needed to be close to home. We went for a short walk and she later told me that it was a very good thing that we came home when we did. I told her that I was very happy that she deferred to me on the decision and her response was “You are my husband.”

I have certainly noticed recently that she is deferring to me much more than she used to. I think it’s part the subliminals, and part my own change of attitude. I’ve finally decided to take full responsibility for what goes on at home, and by doing so, she is much more willing to submit herself. And it definitely helps when you ultimately make the right decision. But if you screw up, you have to own up to it. The “Doms” and “Masters” who take the “my way or the highway” approach are ruling out of fear and I don’t think any of us here want that. My wife’s submission is happening out of love and trust and as long as I don’t screw up in a major way, I see us continuing down the path. Whether she’s actually a “slave” or not is a matter of semantics.

On the other side of things, I’ve decided to stay completely out of giving advice on her job. Last night, she was very stressed about a recent situation that has come up. It’s all office politics and not directly related to the job itself, which is even more irritating. She opened up to me about how she was feeling and my natural instinct was, of course, to give her several potential solutions to her problem. But, as I posted elsewhere, women don’t want you to get them a glass of water, they want you to understand their thirst. I bit my tongue and said a bunch of, “I understand why you’re upset… that must be so frustrating… etc. etc…”

We had this conversation while lying in bed, and she had her head on my chest. An hour before, just after dinner, I could see she was literally on the cusp of hyperventilating. But as she lay on me, I could feel her breathing deeply, her body relaxing and going limp. Again, the subliminals help there, as I have affirmations about her relaxing when she’s near me, but I’ve made conscious efforts to relax her as well. When she was done, she thanked me for listening and said she felt much better and relaxed. I whispered to her that I understood her thirst and she laughed at that and was able to sleep well. She thanked me again this morning and told me again how good she felt.

I think a lot of guys (myself included until recently) get these things backwards. I used to defer to her on household stuff, but I’d feel the need to offer unsolicited advice in her sphere (work, friends, family). Now I think I’ve figured it out. Be the alpha male husband and be the decision maker at home. But also be the loving, supportive husband when she opens up to you about whatever shit she’s dealing with on her own time. Don’t tell her what she should do – I think most women know what they need to do in these situations and if she doesn’t, she will ask.

[gtbear]

03/04/2014 at 6:20 pm

J66R,

Wow! Thanks!

I am jelous of your ability to turn thought to tome. Reading your posts above, gives a clear view of where you are headed and why. In one way or another, your story and your goals are probably echoed by most if not all those married guys here (perhaps everywhere). Seems to me that the differences in paths are more symantics than anything else. The deciding factor/s in desired outcome from playing the scripts are really small differences with the end result / goals being pretty much the same for the majority of gents here. The ‘husband’ / ‘wife’ factor appears to be the defining / refining one.

There is certainly a huge difference (in function and requirements and deference) between a wife and a servant / pet. Even with the dog, there are times that I am going to be paying attention to his opinion. For instance, if he does not like someone, then I am going to keep a closer eye on that person. I want everything he’s got and probably more. He wants his ears scratched and dinner on time. You can call it a contract I suppose… He is not a slave he is an occasional companion but mainly a working dog around the house. He garners some respect mostly due to being large and having huge teath. There’s a old cowboy saying that covers dog’s contract, it goes like this; “A man who can’t shoot his own dog nor shoe his own horse don’t deserve either one.” On the surface this statement is about the dog and the horse but really, at the root, it is about the responsibility of the cowboy. It seems to me that what you and others are saying about contracts is much like that statement, a bit deeper than it appears on the surface.

So, in a nutshell, few wives qualify as slaves but most do qualify as subs of a very special sort. Most (not all) here are working toward a D/s sort of relationship with their wives and that relationship takes on very individualized trim yet remains pretty much constant in general form. The key is ‘wife’ and that incompasses partner in one degree or another. Defining this sort of thing is valuable to me in that it brings clarity of thought and communication.

Just one last thought… King of ones own house sort of includes all the D/s stuff…

[J66R]

03/05/2014 at 12:41 am

Thanks for the thoughts. I appreciate the other viewpoint and especially the effort to try to understand those I expressed. The methods used in both models are similar and sometimes identical. Emphasis and intent make the difference. True, there is a certain callousness I have to display in order to brush aside her emotional resistance to what is happening. From the outside, that is not necessarily unlike the indifference you would have to display towards a person you intend to subjugate into slavery. But, rather than convincing the slave that her fears are irrelevant and that she has no right to them, I am trying to convince my wife that her fears are unjustified and in fact that they are limiting her from becoming more and better than she already is. But then she’s female so logic won’t work, hence the subliminals as an attempt to reframe her reference points.

To the old cowboy saying about the dog: My wife and I recently had a revealing discussion wherein I expressed similar sentiments. She responded by opening up about her reasons for being…ahem…difficult. Things have been better, since.

I’ll also agree in form and structure to your final statement. If taken to their fullest measure both models can result in the two becoming literally a binary being. The functions for which this new being would be most adept, I’ll leave to each man here his own imagination. I’ll just say I perceive they would be completely different.

I’ll also leave a last thought:
Having worked on a farm for my uncle when I was a teenager, I’ve seen the difference between “breaking” a horse and breaking a horse’s spirit. The former makes it useful; you trust it and it trusts you and it’s amazing what you can achieve together for years and years. The latter still makes it useful, but it is simply a mindless tool, a broken one, one that will more quickly become a useless and eventually an unpredictable one at that.

[eldrin81]

03/05/2014 at 2:47 am

@MasterSouthernStar said:

Eldrin;

Your examination of the slave dynamic is excellent – especially in that you recognize there are an infinite number of options for that relationship path.

Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations…

[Fizbin]

03/05/2014 at 5:14 am

@eldrin81 said:
Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations…

Sounds logical to me..

[J66R]

03/05/2014 at 6:31 am

If we can be successful with these scripts we might all just live long and prosper.

[gtbear]

03/05/2014 at 9:16 pm

J66R,

“I’ll also leave a last thought:
Having worked on a farm for my uncle when I was a teenager, I’ve seen the difference between “breaking” a horse and breaking a horse’s spirit. The former makes it useful; you trust it and it trusts you and it’s amazing what you can achieve together for years and years. The latter still makes it useful, but it is simply a mindless tool, a broken one, one that will more quickly become a useless and eventually an unpredictable one at that.”

I used to ride a mustang palamino stallion 12 miles one way in the dark through some very ruff badlands every morning to get to work. Then at about 10 or 12 at night back through the same country to get back to the house. That hammerhead and I came to an understanding the first time we laid eyes on each other (I guess you’d call it a contract) it went like this, He wanted me dead and I wanted him to get me where I was going and then he could die and that would be just fine with me. There was no nice thing that could be done that could not be construed as bad there was no hope of getting a better relationship. He never succeeded but tried often to cripple me or kill me in many different ways. He was a sucker for calf manna… responded (barely) to a jaw breaker hackamore and spurs and I only once saw someone else ride him (a woman… and he was as sweet a pie with her) other than that, he was predictable and useful etc. (under the terms of our ‘contract’) but had to be ‘ruffed out’ (reminded who was incharge) every time I mounted up, none of which was as easy as it sounds. The only thing that could have broken that mustang stallion’s spirit would have been a bullet between the eyes and I suspect that he would have gone down trying to kill the one that shot him. The point I guess is that a horse like that can’t be broken by a sadistic idiot. Chances are beyond good that the idiot would get killed first. May we never be found to be idiots…by our mustang wives.

[gtbear]

03/06/2014 at 12:37 am

It’s time for another update.

I’ve been playing the same 2 scripts, I Love You Husband – Sledge and My Husband Is My Master, for almost 30 days streight and for quite a bit of January as well. It appears that C has pretty much stabalized and I believe is ready for a bump up. I am thinking that I will stick with trainers scripts (unaltered) until I have a bit better grip on how the writing and recording works… but, I think it is time to move her along with My Husband Is My Master and His Happyness – Sledge and Submissive Thoughts – Wife. We’ll see where to from there when I’ve gotten a whole lot better on the scripting and understand the mechanics better.

[J66R]

03/06/2014 at 2:53 am

Interesting story…explains a lot.

[eldrin81]

03/06/2014 at 2:56 am

@gtbear said:

It’s time for another update.

I’ve been playing the same 2 scripts, I Love You Husband – Sledge and My Husband Is My Master, for almost 30 days streight and for quite a bit of January as well. It appears that C has pretty much stabalized and I believe is ready for a bump up. I am thinking that I will stick with trainers scripts (unaltered) until I have a bit better grip on how the writing and recording works… but, I think it is time to move her along with My Husband Is My Master and His Happyness – Sledge and Submissive Thoughts – Wife. We’ll see where to from there when I’ve gotten a whole lot better on the scripting and understand the mechanics better.

Sounds like a good idea. You could use the next 3-4 weeks plotting out scripts getting feedback and perfecting them. Looking at trainers scripts are a good frame of reference as well if he has covered the topic before.

[gtbear]

03/06/2014 at 11:11 pm

March 6th… the new set of scripts are on the machine and playing now. Small note of interest; C was sitting there watching the whole opperation and never asked a question or even acknowledged that something was happening. Just blank, no questions, no curiosity, no anything. Like it never happened. I feel like the invisable script man.

[eldrin81]

03/07/2014 at 2:57 am

My wife does this. I have typed scripts, encoded them all from the computer in the living room, while she was watching a tv show, but had a clear view of the screen. People often don’t see what is right in front of their face if their attention is elsewhere or they don’t understand what you are doing.

[gtbear]

03/07/2014 at 10:55 pm

Still, it feels sorta like majic… only a couple of months ago that sort of thing would have resulted in the third degree. I think she must be starting to relax about having to know everything about everything. Another really good example of that sort of thing happened a few days ago when I was online in the forum typing a reply to someone’s views. There was an incident that occured involving a close relitive that upset C pretty seriously. She knocked on the door which was partially open and then came into the office and sat down in a spot directly in view of the computer screen and began to tell me all about it. I just listened and let it run it’s course and while watching her I noticed that she was trying to read the screen (but not really succeeding due to distraction of emotional problem she was talking about ) When I saw that she was getting more serious about reading, I just moved my hand a few times across her field of vision (wax on wax off) and she instantly lost all interest in the screen, paused a moment (blank look on her face) and then completed what she was saying and left the room shutting the door behind her. Again, it was as though it all never happened.

Today, after only one afternoon and night of listening to the new silent scripts, I am noticing subtle adjustments in C’s demeanor. Hard to put a finger on exactly but subtly more submissive and sweet. Time will tell. I am gently poking at her to see where / what her more intrenched no no’s are and establish where the chinks in her armor are. I am developing a plan to widen those little holes a bit at a time (until I can drive a train of thought through them). Right now, I’m still laying a (hopefully) solid foundation of focused submissiveness and acceptance in her and that seems to be going pretty well. The tuffer stuff is yet to come but I have no doubt now that we’ll get there eventually. Thanks to all of you who have contributed to the process!

[eldrin81]

03/07/2014 at 11:34 pm

Qwerty noted something similar in his journal, where he forgot to nyquist part of the subliminal. Apparently he simply forgot to his select all in Audacity before using the nyquist. Needless to say his wife heard plainly some of the voices as he reported, got upset, but then later was back to normal as if it never happened. Not sure what to make of this phenomenon. Maybe these voices become so trusted by their subconscious that when they do hear or see evidence of subliminal messages they dismiss it. Possibly also due to the fact that they are distracted, and don’t fully understand what it is they are hearing or seeing. The distraction thing I know all to well. I used to work in a Dairy section of a Department store, and people would open the milk doors, look me right in the eye (it was a walk in cooler with the milk stocked from the back) and never see me. Their attention never expanded past what they came to get. People often draw unwanted attention to themselves by acting out of sorts when someone notices something they don’t want them to see.

Another example/analogy: You are hunting in the woods, Your eyes are looking out on the vast landscape. You don’t move your head and your eyes dart back and forth looking at the forest in front of you. Then something moves and you see it, a deer that was perfectly camoflaged in its surroundings, drawing unwanted attention to itself, when you didn’t even ‘see’ it before. For sure, you eyes saw that thing, but your brain interpreted the color patterns as simple foliage.

[gtbear]

03/08/2014 at 12:25 am

Not too long ago there was a show series on the tv called “Brain Games”. One of the many things they got into was showing both how much the brain misses and why, and how much the brain makes up (out of thin air) as if it is reality. In front of a live audience of perhaps 200 people, after asking them to figure out something the dancers were doing, they walked an 8 ft. tall penguin accross the stage. When they asked the audience if any of them had seen the penguin, only 1 or 2 raised their hands. Stage or street majic relies heavily on the brains ability to only process / see 1 thing at a time when focused. It’s why most witnesses to armed robery can describe the gun perfectly but have little idea what the perpatrator looked like…

What I find really interesting about the incedents, including Querty’s, is that the girls actually react to whatever it is but then just sort of go blank about it… no memory of whatever happened. I never saw that sort of thing in C until I started playing these scripts of trainers. I’m thinking there should be some useful way to exploit the phenomenon, some way to make it a valued plus in a script.

[gtbear]

03/08/2014 at 4:57 am

adrz74,

Just a small mention on your last post. I got a lot out of that… it was intertainingly personal and like many of your posts educational and interesting. I get much out of posts that tell of how things are working out with others girls. So, although I am often remiss in commenting back please don’t think you are being ignored. (keep it up) and thanks… Those of us that are just beginning this script playing journey need all the input we can get.

[gtbear]

03/09/2014 at 8:01 pm

It’s day 3.5 for C on the new script set and she has not been feeling good. Yesterday, she had a rebellious and crabby afternoon. I am going to leave everything playing as is and let her adjust to the script change come hell or high water. I think I am too sensitive to the negative verbage and actions of these kickbacks. A little thicker skin on me will result in better seeing these things as what they are (reactions to the scripts) and as passing quickly.

This morning she is making an effort to be less pushy and bad tempered. She is trying to ingraciate herself with me by sucking up and being sweet. I suspect that she doesn’t even have an accurate or complete memory of her bad behavior. Time for me to get a grip and get back to girl training… steady as she goes, all ahead full….

[Tap]

03/09/2014 at 11:21 pm

GT, what subliminals are you playing for her?

[gtbear]

03/09/2014 at 11:34 pm

My Husband Is My Master and His Happyness – Sledge and Submissive Thoughts – Wife.

[trainer81]

03/10/2014 at 3:13 pm

@gtbear said:

adrz74,

Just a small mention on your last post. I got a lot out of that… it was intertainingly personal and like many of your posts educational and interesting. I get much out of posts that tell of how things are working out with others girls. So, although I am often remiss in commenting back please don’t think you are being ignored. (keep it up) and thanks… Those of us that are just beginning this script playing journey need all the input we can get.

thanks GT!

just typing these posts out is helpful to me in terms of self evaluating the process. and if it helps others, even better!

[seekenq]

03/10/2014 at 3:33 pm

GT Bear:

I can relate.
I have also been a bit too sensitive to the kickbacks no matter how minor.
Staying the course is another way of saying steady as in “Slow and Steady”
Another Gt Girls mantra – right after Patience, Patience, Patience

Have you tried a sit down talk with her ?
I have had my biggest breakthroughs when we have a talk after she has “misbehaved”.

For me timing is critical to avoid a fight.
I would love to be a point where she is obedient enough for me to be able to command her stop the bad behavior while it is happening – not there yet.
Instead I look for the phase when she is feeling some remorse about her bad behavior.
IMHO, this is a key opportunity not to be missed.
I then calmly explain that the bad behavior is unacceptable and try to set clear expectations going forward.

I believe the occasional correction is necessary.
This is probably most true when you see resistance or backlash like immediately following introduction of a new concept in a script.
Essentially a gentle “real world” push in the right direction when she is having internal dissonance with her subconscious.
I try to work in a key word or phrase from the scripts in my “correction talk”. (Caution: do not over do it).
My theory is that the inner voices should win every debate and my supporting the “good guys” improves the odds, i.e. 2 against 1.
The more often the voices win (and she sees a positive outcome when they do) the less likely she will be to fight with them.

If I do it right she ends up thanking me for being so open with my feelings and she says it makes her feel more connected.
Quintessential female code speak for I’m sorry.
She then typically makes an extraordinary effort to be better which I reward with positive feedback.
Net result – I need to listen to / obey my inner voices and it always turns out well when I do.

[trainer81]

03/10/2014 at 3:50 pm

I’d be surprised if any of us were able to fully eradicate bad behavior. The key difference I’ve noticed is how quickly arguments/fights resolve themselves now. If she is at fault, she is quick to apologize. If I am at fault and act like a man (i.e., take responsibility for my mistakes), she is quick to forgive.

[gtbear]

03/11/2014 at 4:06 am

seekenq,

“I try to work in a key word or phrase from the scripts in my “correction talk”. (Caution: do not over do it).”

I thought about doing that but decided that I didn’t want her to realize that the inner voice was being implanted by subliminals. If I say what the script says, then she might just put it togeather and it could be catistrophic… or at least very unpleasant for a while.
Of course, there is the ongoing ‘oh well, what were we talking about?’ factor that might function on a ‘as needed’ basis… maybe that is worth the risk just to find out? Right now she seems to be back on course but eventually something will set her off… I’ll be waiting and hopefully will be able to prep a conversational correction to go with her self guilt trip.

adrz74,
I have noticed that behavior in C almost from the start of playing the subliminal scripts for her. It has been like finding a nice new unexpected kind of cookie in the jar… I don’t see anything in the scripts that should be producing that overtly but suspect that it is one of the things the female mind thinks of as ‘submissive’ behavior. Perhaps it is dropping anger as a weapon from their arsenal of non-submissive, manipulative, selfdefenceish behaviors? Don’t know for sure but I like it.

[FaustsBoon]

03/11/2014 at 1:13 pm

If you guys read my journal going wayyyyy back to last year, you’ll see that my success in this area was pretty complete. It probably took eight months or so, but bad behavior is certainly down, and as said above, it isn’t that we don’t fight, or she doesn’t occasionally act childishly, etc… its just that rather than days of her being that way, it might be minutes. Likewise she doesn’t nag, she doesn’t huff and get frustrated over how sexual I am, etc… whereas it used to all be a big scene.

I definitely think subliminals are powerful, gentle, tools for behavior correction. It may not work like hypnosis at instantly locking in desired behaviors (oh, how I wish), but there seems to be a strong “personality smoothening” quality, if you will. :-p

[trainer81]

03/11/2014 at 1:14 pm

LOL @ “unexpected cookie.” Great analogy. So true…

I do think it would be helpful to know precisely why this behavior comes up since I don’t think any of trainer’s subliminals address it directly. Obviously their subconscious minds are interpreting *something* in such a way that they are less inclined to argue/fight. I agree that being submissive could be that thing, but the track I’ve been playing doesn’t have any submissiveness in it.

[eldrin81]

03/11/2014 at 4:09 pm

@adrz74 said:

LOL @ “unexpected cookie.” Great analogy. So true…

I do think it would be helpful to know precisely why this behavior comes up since I don’t think any of trainer’s subliminals address it directly. Obviously their subconscious minds are interpreting *something* in such a way that they are less inclined to argue/fight. I agree that being submissive could be that thing, but the track I’ve been playing doesn’t have any submissiveness in it.

It might simply be that the subliminals are resolving internal conflicts that they have been going through for years that kept them with negative, unhappy attitudes. I know myself when I am happy and relaxed, I let things go, and forgive AND forget easily.

[gtbear]

03/11/2014 at 10:36 pm

I wonder why only the wife has been affected in that particular way and I have not. Perhaps it is due to the thickness of one of our skulls…? More proof that the better half really is the better (and more sensitive) half?

[gtbear]

03/11/2014 at 10:52 pm

@FaustsBoon said:

If you guys read my journal going wayyyyy back to last year, you’ll see that my success in this area was pretty complete. It probably took eight months or so, but bad behavior is certainly down, and as said above, it isn’t that we don’t fight, or she doesn’t occasionally act childishly, etc… its just that rather than days of her being that way, it might be minutes. Likewise she doesn’t nag, she doesn’t huff and get frustrated over how sexual I am, etc… whereas it used to all be a big scene.

I definitely think subliminals are powerful, gentle, tools for behavior correction. It may not work like hypnosis at instantly locking in desired behaviors (oh, how I wish), but there seems to be a strong “personality smoothening” quality, if you will. :-p

FB,
You know, now that I think of it C has not been doing any nagging either. Whatever I want is just how it is and I don’t get any negative feed back on whatever it is … I miss it like one would miss a wort on the nose! Those 2 things, way less fighting / anger and no more nagging are worth the price of admission just on their own!

[eldrin81]

03/11/2014 at 11:16 pm

I have observed that women are much more worrisome of every little thing that the public or friends think if them. They are natural followers and conformists at heart. Men are only likely to conform or follow when they perceive the leader as strong in regards to what they want, and even then most men have learned to be aggressive to get what they want and only yield to the more aggressive alpha male of the group. I really believe many psychological hangups can be traced back to our bestial/carnal nature. We are not so evolved as we like to think we are, atleast not as a species, though individuals can often possess an extraordinary knack for rising above and beyond their baser instincts.

[gtbear]

03/12/2014 at 5:52 am

Bit of an update here:

C has been feeling really rocky today. Acts like some viral thing and had her down and out all day with only brief get ups. Still, she managed to do the bare essentials between sleep spells. I let the little gal lay and sleep and spent the afternoon trying to keep up with the grandson. She has been extreemly crabby when she was up. After the boy got down to sleep and I moved to the office I heard some noise in the kitchen and decided to investigate. C was in there and was getting herself a brownie. I made a noise that let her know I was there and the brownie went back where it came from and she went back to bed. Seemed sorta like a kid cought with her paw in the cookie jar… I didn’t say no brownie, couldn’t care less actually. It seemed like she guilt tripped herself again. She’s been sleeping ever since. Tomorrow, I’ll look for an opportunity to “set clear expectations and provide a gental correction” per seekenq’s advice (I’ll only bring that out if she is showing signs of remorse AND is feeling a whole lot better.)

[gtbear]

03/12/2014 at 6:36 pm

So, it’s tomorrow and C is still under the weather. She is trying to not be crabby and is trying to rest up. I can spot the signs of a girl that feels like she has over shot her bounds and regrets it but is feeling to crappy to do much about it. I went out side and cut some blooming tree branches for the kitchen table and put them in water. Got a thank you and a better attitude… when she is over this crap it’s still on for the correction talk.

[gtbear]

03/13/2014 at 5:54 pm

C is showing signs of getting over the flu/cold/whatever she had for the last few days. Still not hitting on all cylinders but moving and seems to be lightening up. Scripts are still playing. Perhaps by tomorrow it will be ‘lower the boom’ day.

[seekenq]

03/14/2014 at 4:24 am

Best of Luck.
Calm, cool, collected and clear

[eldrin81]

03/14/2014 at 5:23 pm

When you talk to her, try to brainstorm some outlets for stress/turmoil/crabbiness. People need outlets for that stuff, but often fall into the bad habit of taking it out on loved ones. Help her redirect that ‘steam’ someplace else, but be careful not to plug all the ‘steam’ holes entirely, or the only thing ‘booming’ will be her, probably on you.

[eldrin81]

03/14/2014 at 5:27 pm

In general, as you have probably seen over your life, women tend to worry about EVERYTHING:
Below is a probable sample of how a woman thinks daily:

How they look, are they too fat, does this dress match their shoes, do they match what you’re wearing, are you looking too slovenly for the guests, is the house clean, are our finances in order, do her eyes look too puffy? is she over the hill, what about that pudge on her belly, what about the smell coming from the catbox, i mean only I notice it when I’m down in the basement, but they might notice it upstairs then oh GOD… I wonder what I am going to eat, I am not really hungry but I want don’t want to look weird…

If we had all the stuff in their brains running around ours, it would probably drive us crazy too.

[gtbear]

03/15/2014 at 4:35 am

eldrin…? Are you ok?

Actually, a goodly portion of your post above was laid on me by C today in a rambling sort of way. It’s uncanny.

The talk turned out to be a bit of a bust. C was cryptic and calm. Nothing could get her to engage in much of anything with any sort of meaning. Then we had a visit from the boys mom… she is supposed to be in another State but just showed up. Caos for the rest of the afternoon. The girl, C, is pushing the limits on being bossy… even a bit rude, it is not working for her but she seems not to notice that. She is nearing the end of her rope with me. I am going to wait just a bit longer to see WTF is going on between her ears but don’t like what I am seeing right now. Seems very different than anger or such and just a bit cocky if you know what I mean. If it’s a reaction to scripts, I haven’t seen anything like it before. It strikes me as though she has something up her sleeve and is dealing from the bottom of the deck and becoming smug about it. Regardless, I think it is actually going to require some sort of serious intervention. Hopefully in the next day or so, I will be able to identify causation and correct what is to me, almost unbelivably bad behavior. Very very odd. There is a posibility that the girl thinks she is being funny (haha) and if so, a little bit of the shaking of the spurs will be all that’s needed to get things going in the right direction. We will see tomorrow what’s what.

[gtbear]

03/16/2014 at 1:13 am

Late last night I mentioned to C that we were going to have a talk today. She asked what about and was told her behavior over the last few days. There was a long pause and she said, “are you going to make me leave?” I took me so far by supprise that I said No… of course not why? Is your concious bothering you?… It all went very well after that. Today she is on her very best behavior and all seems to be good. A little rattling of the spurs seems to have brought things back into line.

The same scripts are still playing and all seems to be on an even keel.

[seekenq]

03/16/2014 at 2:56 pm

Glad to hear the second attempt went better.
Don’t forget the positive reinforcement for correct behavior (and especially when it is something in your scripts).

[gtbear]

03/17/2014 at 12:01 am

@seekenq said:

Glad to hear the second attempt went better.
Don’t forget the positive reinforcement for correct behavior (and especially when it is something in your scripts).

So, your comment made me think… do I even remember what is in those scripts? Answer = no. That means I need to review them yet again and if I am going to do that then what better time to customize the two that are not sledges. I am by no means ready to make a sledge yet. I guess that I should open a gold version of this thread for posting on that sort of stuff… I’ll start there.

[Tap]

03/17/2014 at 2:32 am

You should save copies of your scripts on your computer for reference. Then you can always go back to them and edit when needed.

[gtbear]

03/17/2014 at 4:10 am

Thanks Tap,

I’ll be doing that.

[eldrin81]

03/17/2014 at 12:46 pm

TextAloud does this for you. All the text articles you type or drag and drop to it will remain there until deleted. You can set it up to simply archive deleted articles as well, to help declutter the text files you see.

[gtbear]

03/17/2014 at 11:34 pm

eldrin,

I seem so recall looking at all that sort of save stuff. Wasn’t quite sure by what the program had in mind for ‘archive’ but that sure looks like the simplist way to get it done… Thanks.

[gtbear]

03/20/2014 at 10:26 pm

So, I downloaded programs and had started doing all the gold sorta stuff. I went to bed after shutting down the computer as usual and next day, the computer would not let me log on. Seems something unknown ate the user profiles and passwords and just about everything that went with them. No saved files now… starting over amid some major mal ware but sans everything saved up till now. CRAP! Oh well.

Same files still playing away. C is basicly easy to get along with and is following up on several tasks that should take her a week or so to get done. I only had to mention casually what I wanted done and how and she has set about it with concentrated vigor. Yesterday, while she was presenting her breasts, I told her she is doing a good job… and said good girl… she said, “Don’t use that term on me. Don’t manipulate me.” I told her, ‘of course she is manipulated and to get over it.’ I think it must be a hangover from some other time… but atleast she is not reacting strongly to the term ‘good girl’ and as so often has been the case, just seems to make a statement and then totally let it pass into oblivian. I am wondering how ‘good girl’ equates with being manipulated in her mind. I will be gently diging to find the answer to that.

[trainer81]

03/21/2014 at 12:59 am

Calling someone is a “good girl’ is like speaking to a small child when she dose something good. Like in slave training you tell good girl when she behaves or dose a good job.

Just common sense

[Fizbin]

03/21/2014 at 5:29 am

Depending on what she had experienced in her past, there are some hypnosis files that set good- and bad- girl as triggers of some fairly intense sensations, which are then used as conditioning rewards and penalties. If she was subject to those files and then had some deprogramming, there may still be some latent resentment toward their use,

[gtbear]

03/23/2014 at 9:57 pm

Trainer,

As in slave training… exactly, however, this is an unexpectedly strong reaction coming from a relitively well trained and practiced girl. She has been called ‘good girl’ for doing well for a very long time so it really supprised me. Thanks for the input.

Fizbin,

I think you have hit the nail on the head. About 25 or 30 years ago there was a period of several years during which C was made literialy orgasmic when she was told that she was a ‘good girl’ it was not unintentional on my part. It was a phase that eventually was abandoned by me but thinking back now, maybe I should re-install the reaction to ‘good girl’ or perhaps it should be done as ‘good pup’ or some such just to avoid any old negativity on her part. As I recall, it was a lot of fun watching her squerm on command and made for some very subby behavior. On the other end of that stick, I almost never tell her ‘bad girl’ because she historicly gets/got depressed and stayed that way for days. I can’t remember the last time she was scolded with that term. I don’t remember what was used to get her to that state of mind. She had to be mildly deprogramed a few years ago to be able to take care of the stuff I couldn’t do any more due to some health issues. So… what you say may fit the bill pretty well.

[gtbear]

03/24/2014 at 1:49 am

A note:

Since that goes back as far as 30 years, I may be clutching at straws… Still, with the subs being relitively new to her maybe some things from WAY back are surfacing. I am trying to think what in more recient times could have triggered / be triggering that sort of reaction.

[gtbear]

03/25/2014 at 2:36 am

C, without any todo decided to start walking at the local park today. Told me she made to laps on a track built for the purpose and that she is planning on doing that (walking) every morning until further notice. I believe it is further goodness from a one afternoon shot at trainers weight loss program more than a month ago.

She has been industriously doing spring type chores of fairly complex natures and has otherwise been taking care of business per my instructions. There was a minor blow up this morning over whether or not to help out the boy’s mother. She stormed out but returned very submissively with an appology for her behavior. She started to get despondant / depressed and wouldn’t say why… I suggested that she had stressed herself out with her bad behavior and told her that her appoligy was enough and to lighten up. She did and almost instantly pulled herself back togeather.
Yesterday, C told me that she wanted to use a dresser from the master bed room in the boy’s room. I told her no, solely because I wanted to see what she would do with the no. She asked ‘why’ and I told her ‘because I said so’. She started to make a case for doing the furniture change and I told her, ‘I told you no, now drop it’. She did completely. Later that evening I told her that it would be fine if she used it in the boy’s room and she said ok…thank you. Occasionally, over the last few days I have been experimenting with commands that require her to redirect her thought processes from A to B to C. Like, “Do not think about that.” Or That is not for you’. or Find something else to think about”. or You don’t need to know that. and the like. All with near perfect and instant compliance. Seemingly no thought process involved just lights on lights off.

This evening, I am starting a newly customized batch of 3 files that are combined into one. It’s long but she is used to listing to 3 scripts so overall it is actually shorter than what has been playing. Starting tonight, custom -Trainers My husband is My Master, custom -Trainers Submissive thoughts Wife and custom – Taps Good Girl script. 20 complete reps per hour. I’ll post it in gold for any feed back.